Cap'n Clutch wrote:

asq2 wrote:My point is that by trading Volchenkov for prospects, we're signalling that we have no intention of competing with the names I just mentioned. Alfredsson will be retired, Phillips and Kuba will be in the twilight of their careers if not retired, and Fisher will be an old guy by the time Cowen, Karlsson, Wiercioch and Lehner are capable of being the core of a contending team.

It would be more efficient to do a full re-build and trade those guys for future pieces as well. It would especially be a slap in the face to Alfredsson to move the A-Train: you're telling him he'll be spending the last few seasons of his career on a team with no intentions of being anything other than a bottom feeder while the kids develop.

That may be what's best for the team in the long run, but I'm not sure I'm prepared to do that (ie move Volchenkov) because we owe it to Alfredsson.

So are you suggesting Murray pick up some FAs in the mean time in order to be contenders until those prospects are core players so Alfie has a shot at the cup?

I'm suggesting that we not move Volchenkov. Partially it's because UFAs nowadays are becoming scarcer with these longer deals, and are all getting overpaid, so I don't see how to replace him that way.

I'm not suggesting that we move Karlsson for Kaberle and Elliott for Rafalski (not that that jives anymore, since Detroit's goaltending has been better of late) and Cowen for Niedermayer and Wiercioch for Ray Whitney, either. It's very, very unlikely that Alfredsson will win a Cup as a player on the Sens. But there's a huge difference between trying and intentionally being a bottom-feeder and re-building. He admitted himself that last season was probably the hardest for him in the NHL. Do you want to condemn him to three more years like that, in his final contract?

Now, moving Volchenkov on his own probably won't do that, but it's symbolic of differing attitudes. Certainly, moving Volchenkov isn't going to make us any better in the short-term.

N4L wrote:
As for owing it to Alfi, we owe him a cup for sure, but a lot of teams owed it to a guy to win a cup but it just isnt possible in Ottawa. Alfi will not win a cup in Ottawa, doesnt mean you have to trade him. You need him here for a rebuild just as much as you would need him here for a cup run. Thus I dont buy the "you have to trad everyone to truly rebuild"

Alfie will win a Cup with Ottawa, whether he be playing at the time or whether he be President at the time, he will win one here.

I still don't think we need to rebuild either, we need to rebuild our D though, that I do believe.

Dash wrote:Having , let's say, 3.5 million to spend elsewhere, like a legitimate #1 dman, is much better than spending another 3.5 (like Phillips) on a one-dimensional player. If you had a defence of all Volchenkovs and Phillips, you could expect maybe 12 goals total from your defence. We need a Cambpell, Boyle, Bouwmeester, Weber, Phaneuf, Burns, Pronger, Chara...

These guys don't just fall out of the sky. There's nobody out there that will magically sign with us with our cap space, especially since we'll be a dung team without him. Look no further than us signing an over-the-hill Kovalev to a $10 million deal for proof.

Anyway, Volchenkov is better than Phaneuf, better than Campbell and better than Burns this season.

He's contributed offensively, was an absolute behemoth on our penalty kill and makes our blue-line much more deep, given that we can then put an NHL-calibre defender in Kuba on the second pairing.

Dump Cheechoo in the minors, trade Kovalev away with incentives if need be. Again, if you're Chicago, do you let Keith walk because you've got Campbell?

There was a lot more going on in Ottawa last year then just losing, along with the year before. 1, his year started out with a knee opperation, then you have your 2nd fired coach in less then a year, Im sure the Heatley thing was well known in the locker room before anyone really knew for sure what was going on.

Losing like they did last year and losing while giving an effort and playing to the best of their abilities are two completely different things. Ill buy a ticket to a hard working team that's in every game and will lose more then they win.

N4L wrote:

asq2 wrote:Chris Kelly is a fourth line player earning $2.2 million. That's way above the price generally reserved for that role. Anyway, he's only been here since the lock-out.

Volchenkov is one of our top-pairing defenceman (I would say our number 1 this season) earning $2.5 million, which is way below the price generally reserved for that role. Even when we discuss $4 million, for the role he plays that's at best a fair salary for him.

While Kelly is entrenched in the team, he's significantly less of a key to our success.

I'm not particularly sure how moving Volchenkov creates a more balanced team, since defence is our worst attribute at the moment and he's one of only 3 top-4 calibre defencemen on the squad.

Unless, of course, you're talking about teams several years down the line, but then the same can equally be said of Alfredsson, Phillips, Kuba, Fisher, etc.

No way a player like A Train should be making more then 3.5. The guy isnt a game changer, he's a solid number 3, 4 guy and should be paid as such. Just because he MIGHT be the number 1 in Ottawa doesnt make him a number 1 defenseman.

Am I the only one remembering what this guy does on the penalty kill?

It's not like he's asking for $8 million a season and we're debating whether to give it to him. This guy is an absolute rock and we shouldn't trade him just because we're paying too much money to players with substantially less of a role like Neil and Kelly.

N4L wrote:There was a lot more going on in Ottawa last year then just losing, along with the year before. 1, his year started out with a knee opperation, then you have your 2nd fired coach in less then a year, Im sure the Heatley thing was well known in the locker room before anyone really knew for sure what was going on.

Losing like they did last year and losing while giving an effort and playing to the best of their abilities are two completely different things. Ill buy a ticket to a hard working team that's in every game and will lose more then they win.

That's seems contradictory to your willingness to trade the player who embodies hard work, self-sacrifice and team mentality.

It's not like he's Jason Smith, either, he's a damn good hockey player.

Also, while your point about Heatley is valid, I highly doubt Alfredsson wants to play out his final few years on a team with no intention of being anything more than a bottom feeder. He'd be better off retiring or playing somewhere else.

SensGirl11 wrote:

N4L wrote:
As for owing it to Alfi, we owe him a cup for sure, but a lot of teams owed it to a guy to win a cup but it just isnt possible in Ottawa. Alfi will not win a cup in Ottawa, doesnt mean you have to trade him. You need him here for a rebuild just as much as you would need him here for a cup run. Thus I dont buy the "you have to trad everyone to truly rebuild"

Alfie will win a Cup with Ottawa, whether he be playing at the time or whether he be President at the time, he will win one here.

I still don't think we need to rebuild either, we need to rebuild our D though, that I do believe.

Winning it as a player is a lot different then winning it as a part of managment. Def not the same. There isnt a Sens fan on the planet that doesnt want to see Alfi hoisting the cup, but it wont be as the captain.

Trading him in the last year of his contract is perhaps something that may happend but not with 3 years to go.

People seem to be really selling guys like Cowen and Karlsson really short. Even Lee is starting to turn things around. Cowen was supposed to be a top 5 overall pick before his injury and is showing why that is as the Captain of Spokane. Karlsson, Cowen and maybe even Lee (If he continues to improve) should all have an impact on D next season. We still have Leclaire and Elliott so Lehner shouldn't even enter the conversation. Weircioch doesn't need to be on the team for this D to be good as early as next season. I think if A-Train is traded it sends one or a combination of the following as a message:

A - Volchie wanted too much money

B - Cowen is ready to step in and be an impact player

C - Ottawa has no chance of making the playoffs and the return in a trade was too good to turn down

When I say a blue chip prospect for A train I mean someone who could likely step in to the top six next season and be an impact player not someone who will develop in the system for 2 or 3 years and the hopefully with some luck he'll be a top six forward.

asq2 wrote:

N4L wrote:

asq2 wrote:Chris Kelly is a fourth line player earning $2.2 million. That's way above the price generally reserved for that role. Anyway, he's only been here since the lock-out.

Volchenkov is one of our top-pairing defenceman (I would say our number 1 this season) earning $2.5 million, which is way below the price generally reserved for that role. Even when we discuss $4 million, for the role he plays that's at best a fair salary for him.

While Kelly is entrenched in the team, he's significantly less of a key to our success.

I'm not particularly sure how moving Volchenkov creates a more balanced team, since defence is our worst attribute at the moment and he's one of only 3 top-4 calibre defencemen on the squad.

Unless, of course, you're talking about teams several years down the line, but then the same can equally be said of Alfredsson, Phillips, Kuba, Fisher, etc.

No way a player like A Train should be making more then 3.5. The guy isnt a game changer, he's a solid number 3, 4 guy and should be paid as such. Just because he MIGHT be the number 1 in Ottawa doesnt make him a number 1 defenseman.

Am I the only one remembering what this guy does on the penalty kill?

It's not like he's asking for $8 million a season and we're debating whether to give it to him. This guy is an absolute rock and we shouldn't trade him just because we're paying too much money to players with substantially less of a role like Neil and Kelly.

What's the difference between A Train and Jay Mckee, honestly? It's not 3 million dollars. I love A Train as a player but he is limited in what he can do. EDIT Im not saying Vulchi isnt a better player then Mckee, just not 3 million dollars better.

Just because A Train is a hard worker and sacrafices the body doesnt mean other guys dont or shouldnt. A Train leaving The Sens wouldnt change the dynamic of the team all that much in the short term and defently not the long term.

Am I gonna complain or question anything if A Train is resgined? Hell no, I'll be as happy as anyone, all I am saying is trading A Train is a possibility and a good one IMO if things go down hill in Ottawa and there is an offer made that makes a lot of sense for Murray.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:People seem to be really selling guys like Cowen and Karlsson really short. Even Lee is starting to turn things around. Cowen was supposed to be a top 5 overall pick before his injury and is showing why that is as the Captain of Spokane. Karlsson, Cowen and maybe even Lee (If he continues to improve) should all have an impact on D next season. We still have Leclaire and Elliott so Lehner shouldn't even enter the conversation. Weircioch doesn't need to be on the team for this D to be good as early as next season. I think if A-Train is traded it sends one or a combination of the following as a message:

A - Volchie wanted too much money

B - Cowen is ready to step in and be an impact player

C - Ottawa has no chance of making the playoffs and the return in a trade was too good to turn down

When I say a blue chip prospect for A train I mean someone who could likely step in to the top six next season and be an impact player not someone who will develop in the system for 2 or 3 years and the hopefully with some luck he'll be a top six forward.

I'd imagine I've watched them play more than 95% (if not all) of the posters on this site. Defencemen take a while to develop, unless they're Doughties, Bogosians, or Johnsons. Even Schenn took a step back this season.

Cowen is arguably a prospect of or close to that calibre (definitely on a par with Schenn, anyway), so there's a good chance he could step in and have a decent impact. Karlsson and Wiercioch will take longer because they're not at NHL-calibre weight and Karlsson's D is still a work in progress.

However, I think this season, especially since Kuba and Volchenkov have been alternatively down, has proven that you need more than one or two solid defencemen to compete. That Cowen and Karlsson and to a lesser extent Wiercioch are on the verge of being integrated/have already begun being integrated onto the NHL squad is all the more reason to re-sign Volchenkov, because we can try to compete whilst taking advantage of their rookie salaries.

You re-sign Volchenkov, and you have:

Phillips - top-4 offensive defenceman if available (or Lee)
Cowen - Volchenkov
Kuba - Karlsson
*Carkner

That's not an overwhelming blue-line, but it's much more competitive and deep than it is this season and Cowen and Karlsson are integrated and playing with capable, experienced partners.

People talk about Volchenkov asking for too much money but I highly doubt he'll wind up with more than $4 million, or at the very worst $4.5 million. That's only a $1.5-2 million raise. Why has nobody addressed the idea of moving salary up front? We've got replaceable guys like Ruutu, Neil and Kelly earning significant coin, and under-achievers like Kovalev and Cheechoo earning big coin as well.

The money differential between our forwards and our defence is outrageous. Spezza and Kovalev earn more than our entire regular blue-line combined. It'd be good to pay someone like Volchenkov some coin because it would be symbolic of a desire to create a more balanced roster.

You can talk about the length of the deal, which is definitely where the downsides come in, but by then Kuba's no longer on the payroll, and later in the deal, if necessary, it's easier to buy him out. Also, if you're seriously concerned with the lack of forward prospects, we've got three picks in the first two rounds this season.

I just think there are so many better solutions to our problems than trading Volchenkov.

I would rather have A Train then Kuba if that is the actual choice. 3.7 for A Train over 3.7 for Kuba, yes. Again though, it all comes down to numbers, the circumstances going forward, and so on.

Kuba's deal runs out in two seasons after this one. He'll be 35 and you can just let him walk.

Either way, Im no saying to trade A Train but it could happen. A lot depends on how they do once he's back in the lineup and what he's asking for.

Obviously. I'm just saying that from the evidence that we've received thus far, it doesn't make sense to trade Volchie unless you want to do a full re-build.

To be perfectly honest if we're not contenders I'd prefer to take the Pittsburgh Penguins route to success by sucking arse for 2 or 3 years and picking up players in the draft that are close to the calibre of Malkin, Crosby and J. Staal. I do realize that will never happen here in Ottawa so lets keep on tinkering and tweaking in hopes of the right mix.

asq2 wrote:Obviously. I'm just saying that from the evidence that we've received thus far, it doesn't make sense to trade Volchie unless you want to do a full re-build.

Well it also doesnt make sense to sign Vulchankov for 5 years at 4.5 mil. Again, there are a lot of scenario's that have to play out along with what the desires are of the team and player.

If A Train asked for what Komiserek got, I would let him walk. I dont think he's a 4 million dollar D man.

It also won't happen because players the calibre of Crosby and Malkin are generational and not found in most drafts. Hall is a terrific player, but definitely a cut below at least.

If you do want to do that (and we did it before, with less successful results coming from Yashin and Daigle), though, then we're moving most of our blue-line, Alfredsson, Fisher, and maybe even Spezza.

I don't see that happening either.

asq2 wrote:
People talk about Volchenkov asking for too much money but I highly doubt he'll wind up with more than $4 million, or at the very worst $4.5 million. That's only a $1.5-2 million raise. Why has nobody addressed the idea of moving salary up front? We've got replaceable guys like Ruutu, Neil and Kelly earning significant coin, and under-achievers like Kovalev and Cheechoo earning big coin as well.

The money differential between our forwards and our defence is outrageous. Spezza and Kovalev earn more than our entire regular blue-line combined. It'd be good to pay someone like Volchenkov some coin because it would be symbolic of a desire to create a more balanced roster.

You can talk about the length of the deal, which is definitely where the downsides come in, but by then Kuba's no longer on the payroll, and later in the deal, if necessary, it's easier to buy him out. Also, if you're seriously concerned with the lack of forward prospects, we've got three picks in the first two rounds this season.

I just think there are so many better solutions to our problems than trading Volchenkov.

That's exactly it. When it comes to this discussion, both you and N4L raise differing but equally valid points. The logic behind trading him, given a set of assumptions about the state of this team, has definite merit. That being said, the logic behind re-signing him and shedding some unnecessary salary from the forward ranks is very strong.

Before he got injured, Volchenkov was our best defender. It wasn't a question. He was making smarter plays in all three zones than any of the others and leading all of them in virtually every statistical category. Additionally, we've gone in the tank since his injury and we've now fallen well behind the Conference leaders. While we may not be a true contender in the East, we certainly boast a roster that should be in the upper echelon of teams in the Eastern Conference.

When you look at our salary structure for strictly next season, we have almost 35 million tied-up in just 9 forwards; we also have 3 RFA's most of us would like to hold on to and 2 UFA's who can take the spot of someone already signed for that season (Shannon for Cheechoo and Donovan for Ruutu). Our defense, on the other hand, has a an overwhelming 8 million tied-up in 3 players, with a additional 2+ likely to be added to the squad in the form of our two prized rookies. That leaves 1-2 slot(s) open for an additional player to round out the D-corps. We have 1 UFA and 3 RFA's. The hierarchy for priority re-signings is debatable, but the 1st slot is not---we all know Volchenkov is more important to this team now and in the future than any of Lee, Campoli, or Picard; in all likelihood, we can get all three of them on 2-way contracts, but if one holds out we can just tell him to go Diddle himself.

Add in goalies and we've got approximately 46-47 million tied-in to 9 F, 5 D, and 2 G. That leaves us almost 10M for 3-4 forwards and 1-2 D. Obviously we all know to look a little further down the line than that, but thats the financial snapshot for next season. At worst (best) players like Regin, Lee, and Foligno have solid seasons and we have to fork over 3M to each of them. Add in Winchester and Smith at 1M total and there's your 10M.

So what do we do? Buy out Cheechoo? Thats 2M saved. Trade Ruutu? With the replacement player, that somewhere in the $500,000 range. Trade/buy-out Kelly? That's another 1.5-2.2M to add in, minus the cost of his replacement.

The question is: Are we a better team with Volchenkov---and for the sake of argument, let's say Winchester, Smith, and Bass---than we are with Cheechoo, Ruutu, and Kelly, plus a downgrade, Volchie replacement?

Imo the value of those 3 tradeables shouldn't be underestimated, but it still doesn't match what Volchenkov brings to the table. He is far less replaceable than any of the three we would have to move to afford him. And the year after, Kovalev comes off the books, which immediately frees up the money Volchenkov's contract will take up, plus...

True. It doesn't always work out. I would even take guys of the Phaneuf, Shae Weber, Kane, Toews, Tavares, Stamkos, Mike Green calibre for a couple seasons of drafting.

N4L wrote:I would rather have A Train then Kuba if that is the actual choice. 3.7 for A Train over 3.7 for Kuba, yes. Again though, it all comes down to numbers, the circumstances going forward, and so on.

Oh yeah: and we can trade Kuba once his NTC expires on June 30, 2010.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:To be perfectly honest if we're not contenders I'd prefer to take the Pittsburgh Penguins route to success by sucking arse for 2 or 3 years and picking up players in the draft that are close to the calibre of Malkin, Crosby and J. Staal. I do realize that will never happen here in Ottawa so lets keep on tinkering and tweaking in hopes of the right mix.

People often overlook or disregard what Murray wants here. It's about the fan base and the owner, too, but the man building the roster is in his twilight and is undoubtedly looking for some immediate success. Asq mentioned doing what's right by Alfie, and that fits quite well with our GM, who is in a very similar situation as the Captain. The remaining timeline for Alfie's playing career likely mirrors the remaining timeline Murray's managerial career.

We all want what's best for the team in the long-term, but a full-scale rebuild will not happen so long as Murray is at the helm. Hopefully they do find that right mix at some point during that timeline. You'd get no objections from me.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:True. It doesn't always work out. I would even take guys of the Phaneuf, Shae Weber, Kane, Toews, Tavares, Stamkos, Mike Green calibre for a couple seasons of drafting.

Phaneuf is a 9th over-all pick, Mike Green 28th over-all, Shea Weber was found in the 2nd round.

It seems pretty evident that we've had success in the draft recently without picking in the top-5. Karlsson, Cowen, Lehner, Wiercioch and Silfverberg are our finds in the top-2 rounds in 2008-2009. Petersson and Grant look pretty good outside of that, as does Zack Smith.

I've been a proponent of tanking in the past, but it's definitely not the only way to go and I just don't feel it's fair to Alfredsson.

Gohan wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:To be perfectly honest if we're not contenders I'd prefer to take the Pittsburgh Penguins route to success by sucking arse for 2 or 3 years and picking up players in the draft that are close to the calibre of Malkin, Crosby and J. Staal. I do realize that will never happen here in Ottawa so lets keep on tinkering and tweaking in hopes of the right mix.

People often overlook or disregard what Murray wants here. It's about the fan base and the owner, too, but the man building the roster is in his twilight and is undoubtedly looking for some immediate success. Asq mentioned doing what's right by Alfie, and that fits quite well with our GM, who is in a very similar situation as the Captain. The remaining timeline for Alfie's playing career likely mirrors the remaining timeline Murray's managerial career.

We all want what's best for the team in the long-term, but a full-scale rebuild will not happen so long as Murray is at the helm. Hopefully they do find that right mix at some point during that timeline. You'd get no objections from me.

Good point.

We can debate the merits of different moves, but it's pretty clear a radical shift in direction or outlook won't happen.

Like I said in another thread. Regardless of what we think will happen we will most likely see A-Train re-signed based on Murray's MO.

Cap'n Clutch wrote:Like I said in another thread. Regardless of what we think will happen we will most likely see A-Train re-signed based on Murray's MO.

Yeah, I said that last night. Murray would be loathe to let a hard-nosed warrior like A-Train go.

The talk seems to be that we can't keep Kuba, Phillips, and Volchenkov together going forward. If that's the case, I'd rather see Kuba dealt. Volchenkov's game would be harder to replace than Kuba's imo. Plus I think Kuba's offensive upside would fetch more at the deadline (which is almost certainly when one of them would be moved).

That talk seems perfectly ridiculous to me.

It's like we're hellbent on spending $50 million on our forwards, all else be damned.

Whilst I understand the arguments to trading A-Train - especially for a guy like Beech (18 goals in 18 games - a lot of them coming from Jared Cowen), the importance of keeping the quality of the D-man we have right now - and adding the rookies like Cowen and Karlsson next year, then Wiercioch in 2 or 3 years will make the transition a lot easier.

@Hemlock: Well two of them have NTC's so its highly unlikely either would be dealt then. I think this discussion is about next year and beyond.

And I agree with you.

Gohan wrote:@Hemlock: Well two of them have NTC's so its highly unlikely either would be dealt then. I think this discussion is about next year and beyond.

And I agree with you.

If it's even a discussion at all. Have we got an idea from Murray somehow that talks aren't going well? Are we even at the point of looking at this as a viable option? Right now, Volchenkov is the unsung backbone of that D. Right now there are no real issues with having to sign him before some soft deadline or risk losing him. Right now, we can't afford to trade him, particularly for say, a guy like Beach and pick, unless Murray is planning to have Taylor Hall centre Beach, because without Volchenkov, we've been pretty miserable defensively.

asq2 wrote:That talk seems perfectly ridiculous to me.

It's like we're hellbent on spending $50 million on our forwards, all else be damned.

Down the line I'd much rather have a $7 million centreman (who we've already got), and a $5-6 million D-man and goaltender (who we could potentially have).

I don't like the idea of taking on a massive contract at any position right now, unless his name is Weber, Kopitar or someone of that stature. I'd much rather grow our own superstars. Every successful team has balance and to do that in todays NHL that means having value contracts. The best way to do that, is to grow your own.

I'm perfectly happy to wait for the 3 horses on D, and Lehner and whomever else. Sure, I'd love to see Alfie win one, but we just don't have the kind of great young players on value contracts to have a championship calibre team....yet.

hemlock wrote:

Down the line I'd much rather have a $7 million centreman (who we've already got), and a $5-6 million D-man and goaltender (who we could potentially have).

I don't like the idea of taking on a massive contract at any position right now, unless his name is Weber, Kopitar or someone of that stature. I'd much rather grow our own superstars. Every successful team has balance and to do that in todays NHL that means having value contracts. The best way to do that, is to grow your own.

I'm perfectly happy to wait for the 3 horses on D, and Lehner and whomever else. Sure, I'd love to see Alfie win one, but we just don't have the kind of great young players on value contracts to have a championship calibre team....yet.

Yeah, that sums it up pretty well.

I don't think we're close to being a contender either. But trying to be one (within reason) is IMO better than tanking when you've got a player who means as much to your franchise as Alfredsson playing out his last few years.

There are other benefits to keeping Volchenkov as well IMO. You can develop more of a culture of winning, and equip both Karlsson and Cowen with experienced partners.

Chances are quite good that if A-Train stays he'll be paired with Phillips so in fact if he leaves there is a better chance of Karlsson and Cowen being paired with Kuba and Phillips giving you the experienced partners you want them with.

Gohan wrote:

Cap'n Clutch wrote:To be perfectly honest if we're not contenders I'd prefer to take the Pittsburgh Penguins route to success by sucking arse for 2 or 3 years and picking up players in the draft that are close to the calibre of Malkin, Crosby and J. Staal. I do realize that will never happen here in Ottawa so lets keep on tinkering and tweaking in hopes of the right mix.

People often overlook or disregard what Murray wants here. It's about the fan base and the owner, too, but the man building the roster is in his twilight and is undoubtedly looking for some immediate success. Asq mentioned doing what's right by Alfie, and that fits quite well with our GM, who is in a very similar situation as the Captain. The remaining timeline for Alfie's playing career likely mirrors the remaining timeline Murray's managerial career.

We all want what's best for the team in the long-term, but a full-scale rebuild will not happen so long as Murray is at the helm. Hopefully they do find that right mix at some point during that timeline. You'd get no objections from me.

In 2011-12 Kovalev, Cheechoo, Ruuttu, Phillips, and Leclaire all come off the books equalling $15.6 million of cap. Ottawa will likely keep Phillips and Leclaire for similar deals that they are making now. Remove those two from the list and we're left with $9.3 million of empty cap space with our top line and Fisher signed.

As for the RFAs for the 2010-11 season, I don't expect anyone to get a significant raise (Foligno, Winnie, Regin, Lee likely being the only ones who get re-signed), while Shannon, and Donovan will go to free agency, and Volcheknov a wildcard with the prospects coming through the system.

Factor that in with the fact that the cap will likely going up for the next two years, and Ottawa to make a few salary dumping moves because of their depth (Picard, Campoli, at the trade deadline, maybe Kelly) and they will most likely have $12-15 to spend on free agents.

I don't think Ottawa ever does a complete re-build but I think this would be their best chance to overhaul the team. The development of their young defencemen should go a long way with Kuba and Phillips mentoring Lee, Karlsson, Wiercioch, Cowen, and Carkner, guys like Smith and O'Brien will likely get their shots to stay up with the team, and Regin and Foligno hit their strides by then. Ottawa can sign two top-six forwards and/or a vet defenceman and I think we're back in contention. Unfortunately it's looking like it might be a bad year UFA-wise with Chara, and Thronton headlining the pack but not much else.

Michalek-Spezza-Alfredsson
Richards-Backes-Fisher
Foligno-Regin-Z.Smith
O'Brien-Winnie-Neil

Phillips-Karlsson
Cowen-Kuba
Wiercioch-Lee
Carkner

Our record is looking pretty nice despite the absence of A-Train. Anyone re-thinking there stance?

Nope.

Not me personally. I think we need him as badly as ever. Nothing like having a team on a roll and adding one of the premiere heart and soul warriors to it. Re-sign him just so I can see him and Cowen take some shifts together. Or him and Wiercioch.

Kovalfie wrote:Phillips-Karlsson
Cowen-Kuba
Wiercioch-Lee
Carkner

OK, so here you've got:

3 rookies, two of whom will have just turned professional
A sophomore in Carkner
A player in Lee who has yet to stay the whole year on an NHL roster.

How on earth do you expect to do anything with a blue-line like that?

asq2 wrote:

Kovalfie wrote:Phillips-Karlsson
Cowen-Kuba
Wiercioch-Lee
Carkner

OK, so here you've got:

3 rookies, two of whom will have just turned professional
A sophomore in Carkner
A player in Lee who has yet to stay the whole year on an NHL roster.

How on earth do you expect to do anything with a blue-line like that?

In 2012/13 or 2013/14 it'll look quite nice though

I am not sure we want to solve our problems with Campoli and Picard by losing Volchenkov. It doesn't make sense.

I would much rather hire Tonya Harding and Jeff Goofoolie to take out Picard and Campoli. LTIR and no cap hit. win - win!

I want A train resigned in a big way, but I can see it going the other way, that was my only point when this conversation was brought up. IMO the ideal blueline next year will look like this.

A Train/Phillips
Karlsson/Kuba
Carkner/Cowen
Lee

Cap'n Clutch wrote:

asq2 wrote:

Kovalfie wrote:Phillips-Karlsson
Cowen-Kuba
Wiercioch-Lee
Carkner

OK, so here you've got:

3 rookies, two of whom will have just turned professional
A sophomore in Carkner
A player in Lee who has yet to stay the whole year on an NHL roster.

How on earth do you expect to do anything with a blue-line like that?

In 2012/13 or 2013/14 it'll look quite nice though

It'll look better, sure, but Karlsson and Wiercioch will only be 23 and Cowen 22. I think that's probably the absolute earliest we should hope for them to start comprising a top-3.

At that point, Phillips will be 35, Kuba 36 and probably long gone, whereas Volchenkov will only be 31.