Re: UPDATE: Return of the Quebec Nordiques? "Possible", say RDS, Corus Sports, other sources

by **wprager** on Wed 5 Aug 2009 - 6:25

It's ironic, don't you think, that the Federal government is offering to help out Quebec, while no assistance was offered from any level of government for the team in the Nation's Capital?

As much as I'd welcome back the thought of a Habs/Nords rivalry (it would take a few years to get anything close to what we had in the 80s) it bothers me that federal money -- my tax dollars -- would be used here. Maybe they could have disguised it as infrastructure by giving them money to build an interchange or expand the roads leading to the new arena. They didn't even do that here; instead they added the cost to build the interchange to the real-estate value of the Palladium and tus raised the property taxes for the owners.

Did Melnyk ever try to sell that interchange to the City of Ottawa for $1? Then charge them for clearing off snow in winter.

by davetherave on Wed 5 Aug 2009 - 21:39

Prager> with all due respect, sir, where's the irony? Political patronage is part and parcel of professional sports franchises and all the infrastrucure projects, tax dollars and other 'considerations' they generate for the participants.

Peladeau and the Remillards may well have 'hand in glove' relationships with Mr Charest's government, and who knows, some friends in high places in Ottawa.

Looking west to the GTA, it is perhaps RimJim's lack of political clout and/or savvy that is impeding his quest for the purchase of his personal squad of puck pushers.

If the figures we have been seeing are correct, the timing of the 'Retour des Nordiques' may even coincide with a new election. Now that's something the voters in La Belle Province can relate to, n'est-ce-pas?

by **wprager** on Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 6:36

Having lived in La Belle Province for 20 years, being enrolled in highschool as a "Native American" in order to squeak by the language laws, seeing a great many friends move away in the '70s and '80s, having been forced to move myself -- I have a great deal to say about how our federal government seems to always be bending over backwards trying to appease one -- admittedly substantial -- portion of the population of Canada. Sorry for the long sentence -- don't have time to make it shorter. Maybe irony is too soft a word.

I have no issues with Charest lending a hand -- he is the Premier of Quebec. I also did not expect federal money for the Senators (although you could argue that, since this is the Nation's capital it would have been appropriate). I do have an issue with federal money halping out a provincial sports franchise, especially since no such assistance was given to help other teams. Are the feds going to help Winnipeg get a team back?

by **TheAvatar** on Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 7:51

wprager wrote:It's ironic, don't you think, that the Federal government is offering to help out Quebec, while no assistance was offered from any level of government for the team in the Nation's Capital?

As much as I'd welcome back the thought of a Habs/Nords rivalry (it would take a few years to get anything close to what we had in the 80s) it bothers me that federal money -- my tax dollars -- would be used here. Maybe they could have disguised it as infrastructure by giving them money to build an interchange or expand the roads leading to the new arena. They didn't even do that here; instead they added the cost to build the interchange to the real-estate value of the Palladium and tus raised the property taxes for the owners.

Did Melnyk ever try to sell that interchange to the City of Ottawa for $1? Then charge them for clearing off snow in winter.

Actually, I remember that there were a lot of efforts deployed in order to supply federal funds to help out the senators in their time of need. Cabinet Minister John Manley was deeploy involved in assembling a plan but it was voted down. it was also very unpopular with the population at the time.

I'm still very bitter about that (+ the fact that the Bryden had to pay for that stupid overpass).

I think Quebec city should get the same treatment.

TA

by **wprager** on Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 8:12

Voted down by whom? It may have been unpopular with the population (which population? certainly not too many in Kanata would be complaining) but there was no referendum. It was voted down by the government.

As for Bryden, don't you worry about him. Couple of years before I moved here I was working for XIOS -- one of Rod's companies. There was a class action of some sort by former employees to get severance (company policy was a months' pay for each year of service and nobody was getting that when Bryden declared bankruptcy). They managed to get their money (I was only there for 18 months but still managed to get some in a second round) because the lawyers found something o hold over the company board. Anyhow, Bryden declared bankruptcy and even after selling off his biggest assets (PaperCorp and his holdings in BCE, I think) still owed creditors some ungodly sum of money. Yet there he was, just a couple of years later (if not less), being the owner of the Senators. How is that possible?

by **SeawaySensFan** on Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 9:54

We're talking about different times. It's normal, in times of recession particularly, for infrastructure spending to rise dramatically. Those conditions didn't exist at the time Hot Rod Bryden was bankrupt.

Besides, Federal Taxes are collected in Quebec too.

I'm completely in favour of creating jobs and generating tax revenue anywhere in Canada.

by davetherave on Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 10:38

wprager wrote:Having lived in La Belle Province for 20 years, being enrolled in highschool as a "Native American" in order to squeak by the language laws, seeing a great many friends move away in the '70s and '80s, having been forced to move myself -- I have a great deal to say about how our federal government seems to always be bending over backwards trying to appease one -- admittedly substantial -- portion of the population of Canada. Sorry for the long sentence -- don't have time to make it shorter. Maybe irony is too soft a word.

I have no issues with Charest lending a hand -- he is the Premier of Quebec. I also did not expect federal money for the Senators (although you could argue that, since this is the Nation's capital it would have been appropriate). I do have an issue with federal money halping out a provincial sports franchise, especially since no such assistance was given to help other teams. Are the feds going to help Winnipeg get a team back?

Prager> governments continue to demonstrate they are more than willing to do the bidding of those who fund their election campaigns, fill their coffers, and pass along cash in brown envelopes in Swiss hotel rooms.

As you well know, the attitude in La Belle Province is a form of gallic shrug when it comes to patronage--as long as it serves certain interests--and is done with a certain 'je ne sais quoi'. And in that, mon ami, there is more than a little irony.

In terms of the fine people of Winnipeg, remember the reports posted on the Jets thread on this forum? According to the information cited on that thread, the people were screwed by their own government who refused to grant the Jets' citizens' movement tax-exempt status so they could pursue their efforts to keep the team there.

If Les Nordiques return, Monsieur Charest looks like a hero to the hockey-hungry population...who will probably carry him on their shoulders as the O'Keefe flows once again in La Vieille Capitale.

...plus ça change, plus c'est la même estie d'chose...

by davetherave on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:15

"Bettman ne dit pas non" says Corus Sports in their headline today for a story about the possible return of an NHL franchise to Quebec. The NHL Commissioner has given his tacit approval to the efforts of the investor group that apparently includes Quebecor chief Pierre Karl Peladeau. From the article:

Le retour d'une équipe à Québec: Bettman ne dit pas non

lundi 5 octobre 2009 à 13 h 41 - par Christine Roger
(Corus Sports) - Le commissaire de la Ligue nationale de hockey, Gary Bettman, a mentionné qu'il ne s'opposait pas contre l'idée de ramener une équipe de la LNH à Québec.

En entrevue sur les ondes de Corus Outaouais, Bettman a affirmé que la ville devrait se doter d'un nouvel amphithéâtre et que des investisseurs sérieux devraient manifester leur intérêt. Ensuite, le commissaire de la LNH serait prêt à se pencher sur le dossier.

Podcast of the interview here:
http://www.corussports.com/hockey/nouvelles/le-retour-d-une-equipe-a-quebec-bettman-ne-dit-pas-non-1772441.html

---

It seems that if the Quebec group can satisfy the NHL that they have taken the necessary steps to provide a facility which meets the league's standards, the process could advance in a significant way.

With a $50 to $100 million dollar subsidy from the Quebec government assured by Jean Charest, and probably more financial support forthcoming, this could get interesting.

by **SensFan71** on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:16

the Battle of Quebec could be back, that would be amazing, they were always one of the best playoff series' to watch, and I didn't like either team (okay, hated the habs, but was okay with les Diques)

by **RobbyJ** on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:34

So let's sort this out.

Atlanta moves to Winnipeg
Phoenix moves to KC
Florida moves to Quebec City
Las Vegas and Hamilton/Toronto receive expansion frachises.

How simple that would be.

by shabbs on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:40

RobbyJ wrote:So let's sort this out.

Atlanta moves to Winnipeg
Phoenix moves to KC
Florida moves to Quebec City
Las Vegas and Hamilton/Toronto receive expansion frachises.

How simple that would be.

Islanders move somewhere too...

by **RobbyJ** on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:51

RobbyJ wrote:So let's sort this out.

Atlanta moves to Winnipeg
Phoenix moves to KC
Florida moves to Quebec City
Las Vegas and Hamilton/Toronto receive expansion frachises.

How simple that would be.

Divsional and Conference realignment

Northeast
Ottawa
Toronto
Montreal
Quebec City
Hamilton/Toronto
Buffalo
Boston
Detroit

Atlantic
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh
New York Rangers
New York Islanders
New Jersey
Carolina
Washington
Tampa

Central
Columbus
Chicago
Minnesota
Nashville
Kansas City
St Louis
Colorado
Dallas

Pacific
Calgary
Edmonton
Vancouver
San Jose
Anaheim
Los Angelas
Las Vegas
Winnipeg

I should be in charge.

by **RobbyJ** on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:52

shabbs wrote:
RobbyJ wrote:So let's sort this out.

Atlanta moves to Winnipeg
Phoenix moves to KC
Florida moves to Quebec City
Las Vegas and Hamilton/Toronto receive expansion frachises.

How simple that would be.

Islanders move somewhere too...

Not until 2015.

by **wprager** on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 18:55

RobbyJ wrote:
RobbyJ wrote:So let's sort this out.

Atlanta moves to Winnipeg
Phoenix moves to KC
Florida moves to Quebec City
Las Vegas and Hamilton/Toronto receive expansion frachises.

How simple that would be.

Divsional and Conference realignment

Northeast
Ottawa
Toronto
Montreal
Quebec City
Hamilton/Toronto
Buffalo
Boston
Detroit

Atlantic
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh
New York Rangers
New York Islanders
New Jersey
Carolina
Washington
Tampa

Central
Columbus
Chicago
Minnesota
Nashville
Kansas City
St Louis
Colorado
Dallas

Pacific
Calgary
Edmonton
Vancouver
San Jose
Anaheim
Los Angelas
Las Vegas
Winnipeg

I should be in charge.

Since you're in charge, can you also go back to the old Division names?

by **RobbyJ** on Mon 5 Oct 2009 - 19:37

How about the Goodenow, Saskin, Kelly and Penny divisions ?

Mon	Tue	Wed	Thu	Fri	Sat	Sun
1	2	3	4	5	6	7
8	9	10	11	12	13	14
15	16	17	18	19	20	21
22	23	24	25	26	27	28

Should The Nordiques Come Back?