OC Strike OVEr

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    LeCaptain
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    OC Strike OVEr

    Post by LeCaptain on Thu Jan 29, 2009 5:48 pm

    http://www.cfra.com/?cat=1&nid=62790

    As CFRA News was first to report, the OC Transpo strike is over.Three reliable sources inside city hall and another union insider tell
    CFRA news that negotiators representing the striking drivers, mechanics
    and dispatchers have agreed to end the strike and to send all matters
    to binding arbitration -- including scheduling.
    The union did not want the scheduling issue sent to binding arbitration, but pressed for the financial deal to go that route.
    The city did not want the monetary matters resolved through arbitration unless the contentious scheduling issue was included.Sources indicate the city will continue to press the federal government
    to ensure that federal safety regulations apply to drivers -- including
    an eight hour turnaround time between shifts. It is believed the resolution pre-empts the need for an emergency
    debate in the House of Commons, and the need for back-to-work
    legislation forcing an end to the 51-day walkout.

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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by Guest on Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:24 pm

    So let me get this straight.


    Binding arbitration was suggested 50 days ago, but the union refused to include scheduling in the mix. Now they are willing to have it included in the binding arbitration.


    GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!

    I don't normally wish ill will towards people, but that Union leadership deserves some serious bad Karma...
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by wprager on Thu Jan 29, 2009 9:31 pm

    I wonder if they finally *FINALLY* realized that:
    1. The city meant what they said (just like the union did), but
    2. The city could dig in for the long haul while the drivers eeked out $150 per week

    The fact that Ambrose was finally moving on the back to work legislation (I wonder if my three e-mails to her helped to change her mind) probably cemented it: there was no hope of a settlement and the union could not continue indefinitely.

    Mind you, the city *did* move twice from their "final" offer and, really, the union should have been negotiating in good faith. Cornellier will be looking for a new career in 3 ... 2 ... 1 ...
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by wprager on Thu Jan 29, 2009 9:34 pm

    marakh wrote:http://www.cfra.com/?cat=1&nid=62790

    As CFRA News was first to report, the OC Transpo strike is over. Three reliable sources inside city hall and another union insider tell CFRA news that negotiators representing the striking drivers, mechanics and dispatchers have agreed to end the strike ...

    Am I the only one who read that as "...negotiators representing the stinking drivers ..."?
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by PKC on Thu Jan 29, 2009 11:14 pm

    I hope the drivers get nothing from arbitration.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by rooneypoo on Thu Jan 29, 2009 11:23 pm

    Dawg's Wife wrote:So let me get this straight.


    Binding arbitration was suggested 50 days ago, but the union refused to include scheduling in the mix. Now they are willing to have it included in the binding arbitration.


    GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!

    I don't normally wish ill will towards people, but that Union leadership deserves some serious bad Karma...

    Oh, and they're going to get it. The first day the buses start again, is the first day of 51 days of rooneypoo's "piss off the drivers" campaign. Payback time, motherfrankers.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by Snuh on Fri Jan 30, 2009 8:46 am

    rooneypoo wrote:
    Dawg's Wife wrote:So let me get this straight.


    Binding arbitration was suggested 50 days ago, but the union refused to include scheduling in the mix. Now they are willing to have it included in the binding arbitration.


    GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!

    I don't normally wish ill will towards people, but that Union leadership deserves some serious bad Karma...

    Oh, and they're going to get it. The first day the buses start again, is the first day of 51 days of rooneypoo's "piss off the drivers" campaign. Payback time, motherfrankers.

    Hey, I'm right with you man. I lost some income because I couldn't get to work a few times. Until I make that money back, via free bus rides, I'm not paying a dime to ride that service.

    Now, there are a number of drivers that didn't participate in the strike and voted in favor of the city's original proposal, but unfortunately we don't know who they are and they will be forced to take the abuse that comes their way. Don't like it? Talk to Cornellier.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by PKC on Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:03 am

    You guys should hear some of the stories I've heard.

    People losing their jobs weeks ago because they didn't have reliable transportation to work everyday. (PS. Shame on those employers for not being more understanding)

    People who haven't had money to eat since late December because they can't get around anywhere.

    I personally know a friend who lives out in the west end and had two jobs -- one at the Hampton Inn at St Laurent and another at a downtown hotel -- and he couldn't get anywhere after three weeks of the strike because he had no more money to cab and he couldn't consistently find a ride to and from work everyday. (He hasn't worked in 4 weeks now, and he has a child to support)

    People who have been trying to drive to work but have been forced to turn back home because they couldn't find parking spots downtown.

    This whole strike was so pointless and Dung. I hope Andre Cornellier is the first one out the door. And I hope those drivers are ready to put up with some abuse for the first little while. They deserve it.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by Phoenix30 on Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:11 am

    PKC wrote:You guys should hear some of the stories I've heard.

    People losing their jobs weeks ago because they didn't have reliable transportation to work everyday. (PS. Shame on those employers for not being more understanding)

    People who haven't had money to eat since late December because they can't get around anywhere.

    I personally know a friend who lives out in the west end and had two jobs -- one at the Hampton Inn at St Laurent and another at a downtown hotel -- and he couldn't get anywhere after three weeks of the strike because he had no more money to cab and he couldn't consistently find a ride to and from work everyday. (He hasn't worked in 4 weeks now, and he has a child to support)

    People who have been trying to drive to work but have been forced to turn back home because they couldn't find parking spots downtown.

    This whole strike was so pointless and Dung. I hope Andre Cornellier is the first one out the door. And I hope those drivers are ready to put up with some abuse for the first little while. They deserve it.

    I wasnt in Ottawa for this strike but was around for the last one and I remember how difficult it was to get to work. Here is hoping that the Federal Government makes all public transportation an essential service. In this ecomonic crisis the last thing that is needed is people losing their jobs because of lack of public transportation.

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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by Guest on Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:15 am

    PKC wrote:You guys should hear some of the stories I've heard.

    People losing their jobs weeks ago because they didn't have reliable transportation to work everyday. (PS. Shame on those employers for not being more understanding)

    People who haven't had money to eat since late December because they can't get around anywhere.

    I personally know a friend who lives out in the west end and had two jobs -- one at the Hampton Inn at St Laurent and another at a downtown hotel -- and he couldn't get anywhere after three weeks of the strike because he had no more money to cab and he couldn't consistently find a ride to and from work everyday. (He hasn't worked in 4 weeks now, and he has a child to support)

    People who have been trying to drive to work but have been forced to turn back home because they couldn't find parking spots downtown.

    This whole strike was so pointless and Dung. I hope Andre Cornellier is the first one out the door. And I hope those drivers are ready to put up with some abuse for the first little while. They deserve it.

    It should be classed an essential service and written into the contract that they cannot strike. Such a shame that people's live are turned upside because of greed like this. From what I understand, it wasn't money either, rather scheduling for the drivers. Disgusting.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by PKC on Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:41 am

    hemlock wrote:
    PKC wrote:You guys should hear some of the stories I've heard.

    People losing their jobs weeks ago because they didn't have reliable transportation to work everyday. (PS. Shame on those employers for not being more understanding)

    People who haven't had money to eat since late December because they can't get around anywhere.

    I personally know a friend who lives out in the west end and had two jobs -- one at the Hampton Inn at St Laurent and another at a downtown hotel -- and he couldn't get anywhere after three weeks of the strike because he had no more money to cab and he couldn't consistently find a ride to and from work everyday. (He hasn't worked in 4 weeks now, and he has a child to support)

    People who have been trying to drive to work but have been forced to turn back home because they couldn't find parking spots downtown.

    This whole strike was so pointless and Dung. I hope Andre Cornellier is the first one out the door. And I hope those drivers are ready to put up with some abuse for the first little while. They deserve it.

    It should be classed an essential service and written into the contract that they cannot strike. Such a shame that people's live are turned upside because of greed like this. From what I understand, it wasn't money either, rather scheduling for the drivers. Disgusting.

    Well I have to disagree with you guys about the essential service part, simply because it's not. There is no way anyone can justify the transit system as being a something that increases public safety.

    If anyone can definitively prove that this strike caused a loss of public safety, then yes, by all means, deem it an essential service. But that's just not the case.

    It's incredibly inconvenient, and was more or less the by-product of an inept city council (that has failed, by the way, on so many important matters, I'm surprised the citizens of Ottawa haven't revolted yet) and a power-hungry union head.

    I think if we had just had a skeleton system, and had the major routes going through the city, that everything would have been fine (for example, run the 90s: 94, 95, 96, 97).

    Anyways, it's all done now. I just hope that the next step everyone takes is to oust city council.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by Phoenix30 on Fri Jan 30, 2009 10:03 am

    PKC wrote:
    hemlock wrote:
    PKC wrote:You guys should hear some of the stories I've heard.

    People losing their jobs weeks ago because they didn't have reliable transportation to work everyday. (PS. Shame on those employers for not being more understanding)

    People who haven't had money to eat since late December because they can't get around anywhere.

    I personally know a friend who lives out in the west end and had two jobs -- one at the Hampton Inn at St Laurent and another at a downtown hotel -- and he couldn't get anywhere after three weeks of the strike because he had no more money to cab and he couldn't consistently find a ride to and from work everyday. (He hasn't worked in 4 weeks now, and he has a child to support)

    People who have been trying to drive to work but have been forced to turn back home because they couldn't find parking spots downtown.

    This whole strike was so pointless and Dung. I hope Andre Cornellier is the first one out the door. And I hope those drivers are ready to put up with some abuse for the first little while. They deserve it.

    It should be classed an essential service and written into the contract that they cannot strike. Such a shame that people's live are turned upside because of greed like this. From what I understand, it wasn't money either, rather scheduling for the drivers. Disgusting.

    Well I have to disagree with you guys about the essential service part, simply because it's not. There is no way anyone can justify the transit system as being a something that increases public safety.

    If anyone can definitively prove that this strike caused a loss of public safety, then yes, by all means, deem it an essential service. But that's just not the case.

    It's incredibly inconvenient, and was more or less the by-product of an inept city council (that has failed, by the way, on so many important matters, I'm surprised the citizens of Ottawa haven't revolted yet) and a power-hungry union head.

    I think if we had just had a skeleton system, and had the major routes going through the city, that everything would have been fine (for example, run the 90s: 94, 95, 96, 97).

    Anyways, it's all done now. I just hope that the next step everyone takes is to oust city council.

    Definition of an Essential Service.

    Subsection 4(1) of the PSLRA defines an "essential service" as "a service, facility or activity of the Government of Canada that is or will be, at any time, necessary for the safety or security of the public or a segment of the public". Services should be identified as essential where there are reasonable grounds for accepting the probability, or even the possibility, that human life or public safety would suffer if a work stoppage interrupted the duties of these employees. It should be noted that positions where occupants are to be available during their off-duty hours to report to work without delay to perform the essential services are also included.

    Public transportation is used in the event of an emergency because they are generally readily available. Since emergencies are unpredictable would the drivers have come off the strike line to get those buses etc moving who knows.

    I've seen and heard of numerous stories where public transportation has been in the right place and right time to help some in need. In some cases preventing a risk of injury or death to someone. To me that is playing a role in public safety no matter how larger of small.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by wprager on Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:45 pm

    Some specific examples:

    1. More cars on the roads leads to more accidents. Over the course of the 50+ days we've had at least one fatality that I recall. Would that person even have been on the road if the busses were running? How many other accidents were there that did not result in death but resulted in injury?

    2. Some people suffering from mental illness could not get to their appointments. Some required medication but did not receive it, or could not get their prescriptions renewed, or could not get them filled. Some of these people definitely could have been a threat to themselves; perhaps some could have been a threat to others.

    3. Some people had to walk ridiculously long distances to work. We had several major storms during the strike as well as some severe cold. How many people put their lives at risk by having to walk on the road since the sidewalks were full of snow? How many people put their health at risk walking for 45 minute or more in -24 degree temperatures?

    4. How many people were spending their paychecks mostly on gas or taxis, leaving no room for essentials like nutritious food (a $5 box of donuts probably has more than enough calories to live on, but after 51 days you will have problems with your pancreas andd liver); or medicine.

    But the biggest reason for declaring it essential:

    What makes Montreal and Toronto special?
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by Phoenix30 on Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:02 pm

    wprager wrote:Some specific examples:

    1. More cars on the roads leads to more accidents. Over the course of the 50+ days we've had at least one fatality that I recall. Would that person even have been on the road if the busses were running? How many other accidents were there that did not result in death but resulted in injury?

    2. Some people suffering from mental illness could not get to their appointments. Some required medication but did not receive it, or could not get their prescriptions renewed, or could not get them filled. Some of these people definitely could have been a threat to themselves; perhaps some could have been a threat to others.

    3. Some people had to walk ridiculously long distances to work. We had several major storms during the strike as well as some severe cold. How many people put their lives at risk by having to walk on the road since the sidewalks were full of snow? How many people put their health at risk walking for 45 minute or more in -24 degree temperatures?

    4. How many people were spending their paychecks mostly on gas or taxis, leaving no room for essentials like nutritious food (a $5 box of donuts probably has more than enough calories to live on, but after 51 days you will have problems with your pancreas andd liver); or medicine.

    But the biggest reason for declaring it essential:

    What makes Montreal and Toronto special?

    Some very good points. One in particular I can remember here in Calgary was when a bus driver found a toddler wondering in the street. The driver stopped took the 3 year old on the bus and called for police. The toddler had slipped out of the house when the parents was in the kitchen. What could have happened if the bus wasnt there and something happened to the child.

    Another is in extreme cold weather conditions when buses are used to commute the homeless to shelters or even used to give the homeless a place to warm up. How about when there is an emergency evacuation. The public buses are used to provide shelter and transportation to those who are evacuated. Now here is a question would the union allow their members to run buses in some of those extreme circumstances for the welling being of another or could something have been prevented by purely having a bus on the road. I guess we'll never know.
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    Re: OC Strike OVEr

    Post by wprager on Fri Jan 30, 2009 3:37 pm

    The busses couldn't even be used in emergencies because they've been off the maintenance rotation for nearly 2 months.

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