Will Meszaros sit out?

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    Cap'n Clutch
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    Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Cap'n Clutch on Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:44 am

    Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?


    Last edited by Cap'n' Clutch on Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by PTFlea on Sat Aug 02, 2008 5:53 pm

    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?

    What I truly think will happen is similar to what happened with Vermette. I think Mez wants a long terms contract for 5 years at 3.5 million per year or 6 years at 24 million, but I think Murray wants a 2 year contract at 2.75 per year. Why?

    Well...some of the comparable contracts that have been signed are Tom Gilbert and Matt Carle. Carle got the big contract so young, that he struggled to find his game and lost massive amounts of confidence. It led to him being benched and eventually traded. Gilbert's in the same boat, where no matter how good he's been, he now has to be better. Too young, too much money, hasn't earned it properly yet. This new NHL is already crappy in the sense that GMs have to pay guys huge money at the new age of 26 for UFA status, why not excerise your power of holding strong on a lower deal with a friggin' 22 year old.

    2 years, 5.5 million, then we'll re-assess your playing and how effective you've been, what further potential you've reached - and can still reach, how you interact with the team and how you fit into our long term plans. If you dedicate yourself properly and show you're worth 4.5+ over a long term, then we'll work something out.

    That's how I feel.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Cap'n Clutch on Sun Aug 03, 2008 8:54 am

    504Heater wrote:
    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?

    What I truly think will happen is similar to what happened with Vermette. I think Mez wants a long terms contract for 5 years at 3.5 million per year or 6 years at 24 million, but I think Murray wants a 2 year contract at 2.75 per year. Why?

    Well...some of the comparable contracts that have been signed are Tom Gilbert and Matt Carle. Carle got the big contract so young, that he struggled to find his game and lost massive amounts of confidence. It led to him being benched and eventually traded. Gilbert's in the same boat, where no matter how good he's been, he now has to be better. Too young, too much money, hasn't earned it properly yet. This new NHL is already crappy in the sense that GMs have to pay guys huge money at the new age of 26 for UFA status, why not excerise your power of holding strong on a lower deal with a friggin' 22 year old.

    2 years, 5.5 million, then we'll re-assess your playing and how effective you've been, what further potential you've reached - and can still reach, how you interact with the team and how you fit into our long term plans. If you dedicate yourself properly and show you're worth 4.5+ over a long term, then we'll work something out.

    That's how I feel.

    I believe he'll hold out just enough to miss training camp and then sign.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by TheAvatar on Tue Aug 05, 2008 10:29 pm

    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:
    504Heater wrote:
    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?

    What I truly think will happen is similar to what happened with Vermette. I think Mez wants a long terms contract for 5 years at 3.5 million per year or 6 years at 24 million, but I think Murray wants a 2 year contract at 2.75 per year. Why?

    Well...some of the comparable contracts that have been signed are Tom Gilbert and Matt Carle. Carle got the big contract so young, that he struggled to find his game and lost massive amounts of confidence. It led to him being benched and eventually traded. Gilbert's in the same boat, where no matter how good he's been, he now has to be better. Too young, too much money, hasn't earned it properly yet. This new NHL is already crappy in the sense that GMs have to pay guys huge money at the new age of 26 for UFA status, why not excerise your power of holding strong on a lower deal with a friggin' 22 year old.

    2 years, 5.5 million, then we'll re-assess your playing and how effective you've been, what further potential you've reached - and can still reach, how you interact with the team and how you fit into our long term plans. If you dedicate yourself properly and show you're worth 4.5+ over a long term, then we'll work something out.

    That's how I feel.

    I believe he'll hold out just enough to miss training camp and then sign.

    I doubt it goes that far. I think he signs just before camp. (I'm also posting 'cause I wanna see how my new avatar looks) eheh Smile
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Cap'n Clutch on Wed Aug 06, 2008 11:12 am

    TheAvatar wrote:
    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:
    504Heater wrote:
    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?

    What I truly think will happen is similar to what happened with Vermette. I think Mez wants a long terms contract for 5 years at 3.5 million per year or 6 years at 24 million, but I think Murray wants a 2 year contract at 2.75 per year. Why?

    Well...some of the comparable contracts that have been signed are Tom Gilbert and Matt Carle. Carle got the big contract so young, that he struggled to find his game and lost massive amounts of confidence. It led to him being benched and eventually traded. Gilbert's in the same boat, where no matter how good he's been, he now has to be better. Too young, too much money, hasn't earned it properly yet. This new NHL is already crappy in the sense that GMs have to pay guys huge money at the new age of 26 for UFA status, why not excerise your power of holding strong on a lower deal with a friggin' 22 year old.

    2 years, 5.5 million, then we'll re-assess your playing and how effective you've been, what further potential you've reached - and can still reach, how you interact with the team and how you fit into our long term plans. If you dedicate yourself properly and show you're worth 4.5+ over a long term, then we'll work something out.

    That's how I feel.

    I believe he'll hold out just enough to miss training camp and then sign.

    I doubt it goes that far. I think he signs just before camp. (I'm also posting 'cause I wanna see how my new avatar looks) eheh Smile

    After reading Cronman's rumour post I'm leaning towards a signing before training camp as well. I suspect it'll be a one year deal though.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by wprager on Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:12 pm

    I've been thinking about this in the background for a while. Why would he *not* go to play in Russia? He's from Slovakia so there wouldn't be any culture shock, and he'd be loser to his family. The money would be better, and he could still get that big fat contract as a UFA a year or two down the road. If he plays in a big city like Moscow he won't have trouble finding places (and faces) to party, and if the deal is from Ak-Bars or something similar, remember that it's a much shorter season, and he's still a young guy.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Cap'n Clutch on Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:16 pm

    wprager wrote:I've been thinking about this in the background for a while. Why would he *not* go to play in Russia? He's from Slovakia so there wouldn't be any culture shock, and he'd be loser to his family. The money would be better, and he could still get that big fat contract as a UFA a year or two down the road. If he plays in a big city like Moscow he won't have trouble finding places (and faces) to party, and if the deal is from Ak-Bars or something similar, remember that it's a much shorter season, and he's still a young guy.

    Kinda makes sense except, didn't Mesz come over early in his career and play Junior Hockey in order to get used to the NA style? It kinda says to me that he really wants to stay. I think the Russian offer thing is a negotiation tactic and Mesz is hoping Murray doesn't call his bluff.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by wprager on Wed Aug 06, 2008 5:31 pm

    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:
    Kinda makes sense except, didn't Mesz come over early in his career and play Junior Hockey in order to get used to the NA style? It kinda says to me that he really wants to stay. I think the Russian offer thing is a negotiation tactic and Mesz is hoping Murray doesn't call his bluff.

    Thing is, he can have his cake (just a little later) and eat it, too, right now. If he can get even $2.5M in Russia, it's only 50 games and it's tax free. Ottawa isn't about to make the finals and I doubt he gets traded to much of a contender.

    So he can't win the cup whether he stays or is traded (or, at least, not likely). He can have an easy year (fewer games) and collect a tax-free paycheck. He can visit family and then, when the rest of his NHL buddies are slogging it out for a playoff spot he can go to Greece or Cancun or the Black Sea and party like there's no tomorrow. After a nice, long layoff, he can get back to the gym while the NHL guys are still recuperating from the long playoff run and be the fittest guy in camp.

    Or, at least that's how he could see it from his perspective.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Cap'n Clutch on Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:06 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:
    Kinda makes sense except, didn't Mesz come over early in his career and play Junior Hockey in order to get used to the NA style? It kinda says to me that he really wants to stay. I think the Russian offer thing is a negotiation tactic and Mesz is hoping Murray doesn't call his bluff.

    Thing is, he can have his cake (just a little later) and eat it, too, right now. If he can get even $2.5M in Russia, it's only 50 games and it's tax free. Ottawa isn't about to make the finals and I doubt he gets traded to much of a contender.

    So he can't win the cup whether he stays or is traded (or, at least, not likely). He can have an easy year (fewer games) and collect a tax-free paycheck. He can visit family and then, when the rest of his NHL buddies are slogging it out for a playoff spot he can go to Greece or Cancun or the Black Sea and party like there's no tomorrow. After a nice, long layoff, he can get back to the gym while the NHL guys are still recuperating from the long playoff run and be the fittest guy in camp.

    Or, at least that's how he could see it from his perspective.

    I just don't know if he sees playing in the KHL as cake though. It's a lot more comfortable in NA from what I've heard and the accomadations, travel etc.. is all nicer isn't it? Also he knows for sure he'll get a pay cheque if he stays where as he may be wondering if they're promising him money in the KHL but he may have trouble collecting it from the owners?

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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Guest on Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:55 pm

    wprager wrote:I've been thinking about this in the background for a while. Why would he *not* go to play in Russia? He's from Slovakia so there wouldn't be any culture shock, and he'd be loser to his family. The money would be better, and he could still get that big fat contract as a UFA a year or two down the road. If he plays in a big city like Moscow he won't have trouble finding places (and faces) to party, and if the deal is from Ak-Bars or something similar, remember that it's a much shorter season, and he's still a young guy.


    Can someone find out if your rights chage if sign a contract in a different league? I thought he'd remain sens property if/when he came back. Otherwise, he could sign for a year in Russia then come back a FA, seems sketchy to me.

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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Guest on Wed Aug 06, 2008 9:02 pm

    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?


    From what I've heard Muray has offered max 3.1mil of 2-4 years. Personally, I think he's worth 3.5mil / 4years. He's got way too much upside and he showed it his rookie year. Yes he was with Chuckles, but after that, he was with Redden. Letting this guy go is a mistake. I think he signs 3.1 2years, shortly before camp.


    Thanks for starting this Fourum guys, my god I'm tired of Ek's bs and KLee's anger/lack of updates!
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Cronie on Wed Aug 06, 2008 9:06 pm

    CooCooKaChoo wrote:
    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:Hey all,

    Since Ottawa has had experience with hold outs before - See Yashin and more recently Havlat, how do you think this standoff plays out with Meszaros?


    From what I've heard Muray has offered max 3.1mil of 2-4 years. Personally, I think he's worth 3.5mil / 4years. He's got way too much upside and he showed it his rookie year. Yes he was with Chuckles, but after that, he was with Redden. Letting this guy go is a mistake. I think he signs 3.1 2years, shortly before camp.


    Thanks for starting this Fourum guys, my god I'm tired of Ek's bs and KLee's anger/lack of updates!

    Hey hey dude! BElieve me, it is we that thank you for your support. Welcome aboard!

    My buddy is very adamant that Murray's final offer to Mezie was indeed less than $3M and for 1 yr only. It will be interesting to see what pans out in the next couple of days, that's for sure.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by wprager on Wed Aug 06, 2008 9:51 pm

    Cap'n' Clutch wrote:
    I just don't know if he sees playing in the KHL as cake though. It's a lot more comfortable in NA from what I've heard and the accomadations, travel etc.. is all nicer isn't it? Also he knows for sure he'll get a pay cheque if he stays where as he may be wondering if they're promising him money in the KHL but he may have trouble collecting it from the owners?

    The money's there, and plenty of it. I don't think he has to worry about a one-year arrangement. As far as living conditions, they're not likely staying at 5-star hotels when they travel, but when they are in town (assuming a large one) then they can afford to live in five-star hotel.

    I just don't know where the KHL has teams, but at least in the RSL, a city like Moscow will have several teams (back in my day there was Spartak, Dinamo and the Central Red Army, so at least three). Which means that even a lot of the "away" games would still be in-town.

    Hold that. I just looked it up, and apparently the KHL will incorporate all 20 of the RSL teams plus four others. I even found this nifty google map showing the team locations . As you can see, there are 7 teams in the Moscow region within a radius of less than 100 km. Of course their divisions don't seem to be based on geographical areas (the three mid-town Moscow teams are all in different divisions), and I have no idea about their inter/intra division schedule split. However it would seem reasonable to assume that much of the travel will be not too bad. Of course there *is* that one team that is over 5000 kn away (Amur Khabarovsk).

    Now, that's one team I wouldn't want to play for. Can you imagine the traveling involved?

    Anyhow, back on point. If he makes $3M here he gives away half of it to taxes and his agent. Over there he gets to keep pretty much all of it. And living conditions (for the players) are pretty good. It all depends on which team is interested, but even in the worst case, he young, he's got no family and he can tough it out for a few months.
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by wprager on Wed Aug 06, 2008 9:57 pm

    I find the conflicting rumours (hee, hee) interesting. If Murray offered a one-year $2.4M contract, and I was Meszaros, I'd grab it right away. Put up decent numbers and you're pretty much guaranteed $4M+ the next year. Guaranteed contract are nice (a one year contract and a sever injury could be bad) but I would not expect a young buck like Mezzie (who hasn't missed a game yet) to be worried about that. So if that was the offer and he didn't jump at it I'm surprised.

    On the other hand, I could very easily see Murray not wanting to give away a 4-year term, especially at over $3M per year, given that this guy has had two mediocre years (including his contract year).
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    Re: Will Meszaros sit out?

    Post by Aetherial on Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:02 am

    wprager wrote:

    Thing is, he can have his cake (just a little later) and eat it, too, right now. If he can get even $2.5M in Russia, it's only 50 games and it's tax free. Ottawa isn't about to make the finals and I doubt he gets traded to much of a contender.


    Ottawa does have a shot at the finals this year. They aren't a lock, but I would say the way the teams stand now, they are certainly a possibility.

    Philly Montreal Pittsburgh... are not locks to take the east by any means
    NYR, New Jersey... might even be weaker than last year
    Washington, Buffalo, Boston... could surprise, but they aren't finalists yet
    Tampa Bay, Carolina... seem to be mediocre teams
    Toronto, NYI, Florida, Atlanta... should probably battle for last place

    ... I see Ottawa with a chance and I see Meszaros signing before the season starts, probably before training camp.

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