I need a new TV, HELP!

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    LeCaptain
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by LeCaptain on Mon Sep 19, 2011 9:39 pm

    Go LED. It's amazing for Hd movies and video games. 240 hertz if you can find one. Sharp Aquos or Samsung.

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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 7:47 am

    Flo The Action wrote:jeez can we get a consensus? plasma, LCD... the only thing that is sure is the Diddler is going to be bigger then anything i've previously owned.

    If you want something big the only option (IMO) is front projection. You can go cheap on the screen at first (point it at a white wall or paint a screen on (you can get real fancy with borders and such, and there are special paints you can get for making good screens). There are special projection screens, also, that are great in high-light areas. They are specifically designed to reflect red/green/blue and absorb everything else, so they can be used in fully lit areas. Not cheap, though.

    Of course if you go that route, then there are several competing projector technologies, as well.

    If I were you, I'd go for plasma, because it *will* give you a better picture and you *will* get the biggest size for the buck. Don't worry about burn in unless you're planning on doing a lot of gaming (and most games are designed with this in mind anyway, aren't they?) LCD/LED have burn in issues as well (but less so).

    Power consumption-wise, it's not as bad as some people think, because and LCD/LED set *always* has the backlight on. Plasmas use much less power (at least less than LCD) during darker scenes.

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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:01 am

    Flo The Action wrote:
    Hoags wrote:I suggest these articles:

    The Biggest Mistakes People Make When Buying An HDTV
    http://hdguru.com/the-biggest-mistakes-people-make-when-buying-an-hdtv/5197/

    Plasma TV Burn-In: Fact or Myth?
    http://hdguru.com/plasma-tv-burn-in-fact-or-myth/826/

    Flo The Action wrote:jeez can we get a consensus? plasma, LCD... the only thing that is sure is the Diddler is going to be bigger then anything i've previously owned.

    HDTV Power costs:

    http://reviews.cnet.com/green-tech/tv-consumption-chart/

    You will see motion artifacts (blur) from a 60Hz set, especially for fast motion such as sports. Maybe you won't notice them or they don't bother you. This is a personal preference, hard-core home theater nuts will tell you to get a true 120 Hz set or a plasma.

    If you're getting an off-brand, look up reviews, the old adage "you get what you pay for" always holds true.
    dude you're a star! thanks for that.

    I heard that the signal we receive is 60 hz so 120hz is no use(as of now)

    It's not the signal, it's what your set does with it. An LCD panel can typically switch a pixel off/on a heck of a lot faster than 60 times a second. Problem is, it's not completely "off" in that time frame, so you get motion blur. Faster refresh rates come into the discussion much more when you want to play 1080p-24 film material. Film is shot at ~ 24 frames per second and that does not go into 60, so when transferring film to DVD or other media for playback on TV they will use "telecine" to shoehorn 24 frames into 60 -- google "telecine" or "3:2 pulldown". This results in something called judder (and when someone points it out to you you will probably always notice it). So the newer TVs that do 120 Hz can be fed a 24 fps signal from a blu ray player -- if you watch a lot of film, make sure your set can do that. For 3D you would need to double that to 240. But I draw the line there -- I don't care about 3D.

    Bottom line, the refresh rate, whether it's expressed in Hz or in ms (e.g. on a computer monitor, a 5ms refresh rate means 1/.005 or 200 Hz) will not tell you whether your set will suffer from motion blur or not, because they are not measuring the true speed at which a pixel can switch between full-on and full-off. Frankly, the refresh rate would have to be instantaneous because a pixel is driven on for 1/60th of a second, then immediately to off. If it, then, takes it 1/120th of a second to truly reach "off" you've gone a half refresh cycle with the pixel not quite off -- so there will be motion blur, it's just a matter of whether or not your eye detects it.

    Plasmas are better at it than LCD panels, even the newest ones.
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:06 am

    shabbs wrote:Plasma runs at 600Hz... just saying. LCD still hasn't been able to touch that...

    For under 40", you'll be limited to LCD/LED. I would look at Panasonic, Sony Bravia and LG panels.



    What size Plasma did Michael (The Office) have?


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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:10 am

    Flo The Action wrote:i njust noticed that with a plasma you pay more then double the amount in electricity every year. that's outrageous. it's like almost 60$ a year more. not way to much but it adds up and it's something to think about.

    Not entirely true. If you turn on brightness to 100 and run a white screen then, yes. And in the winter, that extra $ helps to keep your heating costs down a bit.

    Tell me, did you ever worry about how much electricity your old tube set used? Go back a few years more, when they had more tubes than just the CRT -- were you (or your parents) worried then?


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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by shabbs on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:23 am

    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:Plasma runs at 600Hz... just saying. LCD still hasn't been able to touch that...

    For under 40", you'll be limited to LCD/LED. I would look at Panasonic, Sony Bravia and LG panels.
    What size Plasma did Michael (The Office) have?
    Not sure I follow... don't watch that show...
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:36 am

    shabbs wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:Plasma runs at 600Hz... just saying. LCD still hasn't been able to touch that...

    For under 40", you'll be limited to LCD/LED. I would look at Panasonic, Sony Bravia and LG panels.
    What size Plasma did Michael (The Office) have?
    Not sure I follow... don't watch that show...

    Classic episode. He invites people from the Office to his house for dinner and it is really, really awkward. You'd have to know The Office much better for me to even explain.

    Anyhow, at one point he proudly shows off his wide-screen plasma. It looks about 22" and is mounted on a huge swing-out arm. Let me see if I can find it on youtube:

    Here it is -- not the best quality video, though. The Dinner Party is considered by many Office aficionados as their best episode ever. Me, not so much, but it was probably the most cringe-worthy one.



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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by tim1_2 on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:43 am

    For the record, Consumer Reports highest-rated TVs for Picture Quality were all plasmas. Plasmas also handle motion better than LEDs, making them ideal for sports.

    I'll shell out a couple bucks more per month for my plasma over an LED/LCD.

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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by shabbs on Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:59 am

    tim1_2 wrote:For the record, Consumer Reports highest-rated TVs for Picture Quality were all plasmas. Plasmas also handle motion better than LEDs, making them ideal for sports.

    I'll shell out a couple bucks more per month for my plasma over an LED/LCD.
    Plasma also has the best viewing angle. You can be sitting at a very sharp angle and still get a great picture. With LCD/LED, the PQ drops off significantly if you are off-center. If you have a big room with seating all around, this can be a factor.

    The one thing I want to make clear is if you have a bright room with a lot of windows etc... then Plasma may not be the best unless you go high end. The screen on a plasma is glass and this can cause a lot of reflection. Higher end plasmas have a anti-reflective coating on them to cut this down, but you gotta pay to get it (Pioneer Elite, top of the line Panny's etc...). This is where an LCD/LED would be better suited.
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by shabbs on Tue Sep 20, 2011 9:02 am

    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:Plasma runs at 600Hz... just saying. LCD still hasn't been able to touch that...

    For under 40", you'll be limited to LCD/LED. I would look at Panasonic, Sony Bravia and LG panels.
    What size Plasma did Michael (The Office) have?
    Not sure I follow... don't watch that show...

    Classic episode. He invites people from the Office to his house for dinner and it is really, really awkward. You'd have to know The Office much better for me to even explain.

    Anyhow, at one point he proudly shows off his wide-screen plasma. It looks about 22" and is mounted on a huge swing-out arm. Let me see if I can find it on youtube:

    Here it is -- not the best quality video, though. The Dinner Party is considered by many Office aficionados as their best episode ever. Me, not so much, but it was probably the most cringe-worthy one.
    No way that's a plasma. The smallest plasma TV size that I have seen is 32".

    Funny clip though. That show is funny, but I don't watch it regularly.
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 9:25 am

    shabbs wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:Plasma runs at 600Hz... just saying. LCD still hasn't been able to touch that...

    For under 40", you'll be limited to LCD/LED. I would look at Panasonic, Sony Bravia and LG panels.
    What size Plasma did Michael (The Office) have?
    Not sure I follow... don't watch that show...

    Classic episode. He invites people from the Office to his house for dinner and it is really, really awkward. You'd have to know The Office much better for me to even explain.

    Anyhow, at one point he proudly shows off his wide-screen plasma. It looks about 22" and is mounted on a huge swing-out arm. Let me see if I can find it on youtube:

    Here it is -- not the best quality video, though. The Dinner Party is considered by many Office aficionados as their best episode ever. Me, not so much, but it was probably the most cringe-worthy one.
    No way that's a plasma. The smallest plasma TV size that I have seen is 32".

    Funny clip though. That show is funny, but I don't watch it regularly.

    Actually they did have smaller plasmas but perhaps not commercially available. Not saying that *that* was a plasma, though. I just thought of that particular episode when you mentioned plasmas and size.

    P.S. Too bad you didn't say "No way that's 22 inches" because, well, we all know what would have followed.


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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 9:33 am

    shabbs wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:For the record, Consumer Reports highest-rated TVs for Picture Quality were all plasmas. Plasmas also handle motion better than LEDs, making them ideal for sports.

    I'll shell out a couple bucks more per month for my plasma over an LED/LCD.
    Plasma also has the best viewing angle. You can be sitting at a very sharp angle and still get a great picture. With LCD/LED, the PQ drops off significantly if you are off-center. If you have a big room with seating all around, this can be a factor.

    The one thing I want to make clear is if you have a bright room with a lot of windows etc... then Plasma may not be the best unless you go high end. The screen on a plasma is glass and this can cause a lot of reflection. Higher end plasmas have a anti-reflective coating on them to cut this down, but you gotta pay to get it (Pioneer Elite, top of the line Panny's etc...). This is where an LCD/LED would be better suited.

    LED, LCD, Plasma TVs *all* have protective glass. It's not even always the price range that determines if it's glossy or not. My CRT-RPTV has a very annoying protective "glass" (I think it's some kind of plexiglass, actually) which not only relfects badly, but is not entirely flat. I've actually seen instructions on the web about removing this "protective" glass. Not for my particular model, though. It's got to be doable. Really annoying and now that the kids are older I don't need "protection" as much.

    Anyhow, back on topic. All of them have protective glass, and the glossiness is not always related to cost. But I will vouch for the high end Pioneers (you probably won't find any -- they've stopped making them). My brother in law has a Pioneer plasma -- really high end -- and it is beyond fantastic. No glare whatsoever and the colors are way better than any LCD/LED I have seen.

    Also echoing the comment on the viewing angle. If you have a wide room and will have friends over to watch a game, that is a fairly important point to consider.


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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by shabbs on Tue Sep 20, 2011 9:59 am

    LCD/LED screens have a plastic coating, not glass. I have yet to see a "low end" plasma with an anti-reflective layer on it.

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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by tim1_2 on Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:03 am

    Oh for the love of TVs. It is not "protective glass". It is part of the screen. No one should ever ever ever try to remove the glass on their plasma. Some higher-end plasmas have an anti-reflective coating or screen that is applied to the glass. It has nothing to do with protection.

    From wikipedia: "Plasma display screens are made from glass, which reflects more light than the material used to make an LCD screen. This causes glare from reflected objects in the viewing area. Companies such as Panasonic coat their newer plasma screens with an anti-glare filter material."
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by Ev on Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:05 am

    wprager wrote:
    shabbs wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:For the record, Consumer Reports highest-rated TVs for Picture Quality were all plasmas. Plasmas also handle motion better than LEDs, making them ideal for sports.

    I'll shell out a couple bucks more per month for my plasma over an LED/LCD.
    Plasma also has the best viewing angle. You can be sitting at a very sharp angle and still get a great picture. With LCD/LED, the PQ drops off significantly if you are off-center. If you have a big room with seating all around, this can be a factor.

    The one thing I want to make clear is if you have a bright room with a lot of windows etc... then Plasma may not be the best unless you go high end. The screen on a plasma is glass and this can cause a lot of reflection. Higher end plasmas have a anti-reflective coating on them to cut this down, but you gotta pay to get it (Pioneer Elite, top of the line Panny's etc...). This is where an LCD/LED would be better suited.

    LED, LCD, Plasma TVs *all* have protective glass. It's not even always the price range that determines if it's glossy or not. My CRT-RPTV has a very annoying protective "glass" (I think it's some kind of plexiglass, actually) which not only relfects badly, but is not entirely flat. I've actually seen instructions on the web about removing this "protective" glass. Not for my particular model, though. It's got to be doable. Really annoying and now that the kids are older I don't need "protection" as much.

    Anyhow, back on topic. All of them have protective glass, and the glossiness is not always related to cost. But I will vouch for the high end Pioneers (you probably won't find any -- they've stopped making them). My brother in law has a Pioneer plasma -- really high end -- and it is beyond fantastic. No glare whatsoever and the colors are way better than any LCD/LED I have seen.

    Also echoing the comment on the viewing angle. If you have a wide room and will have friends over to watch a game, that is a fairly important point to consider.

    I hate that about my CRT. It also cuts off the screen, so you miss out on an inch or so on both sides. Really annoying.
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:17 am

    tim1_2 wrote:Oh for the love of TVs. It is not "protective glass". It is part of the screen. No one should ever ever ever try to remove the glass on their plasma. Some higher-end plasmas have an anti-reflective coating or screen that is applied to the glass. It has nothing to do with protection.

    From wikipedia: "Plasma display screens are made from glass, which reflects more light than the material used to make an LCD screen. This causes glare from reflected objects in the viewing area. Companies such as Panasonic coat their newer plasma screens with an anti-glare filter material."

    If you read my post carefully you will see the part where I say I have a CRT RPTV.


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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by tim1_2 on Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:11 am

    It wasn't totally clear to me if you were saying the glass could be removed just for CRT-RPTVs, or all TVs in general. You also call it "protective glass" for plasmas, when it really isn't.
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    Re: I need a new TV, HELP!

    Post by wprager on Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:19 am

    tim1_2 wrote:It wasn't totally clear to me if you were saying the glass could be removed just for CRT-RPTVs, or all TVs in general. You also call it "protective glass" for plasmas, when it really isn't.

    Well, technically it is:


    Unlike the old CRTs, which have no native resolution, the plasma screen is made up of tiny cells filled with gas (which turns to plasma when "on"). The panel with these cells is sandwiched between two dielectric plates (to apply voltage across the cells), and then there is the plate of glass on the front of all of this, to protect the other layers.


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