(1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

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    Total Votes: 24

    Hoff-Machine
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by Hoff-Machine on Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:17 am

    wprager wrote:
    Number Twenty Nine wrote:
    Hoags wrote:
    SpezDispenser wrote:
    Great...1 good game. Ahhhhh!

    MacLean might still play him, hard to say.

    I can't wait to see how MacLean handles coaching in the postseason. Bylsma outcoached Clouston in our last postseason appearance so hopefully MacLean can match Torts.

    I would think McClean has more playoff experience with him being in Detroit and all.......

    So you think the 20,000 fans sitting at the Joe are also qualified to coach in the playoffs? Or maybe just the 20 sitting behind the bench?

    What a terrible terrible analogy Facepalm

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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by wprager on Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:49 am

    Michallica wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Number Twenty Nine wrote:
    Hoags wrote:
    SpezDispenser wrote:
    Great...1 good game. Ahhhhh!

    MacLean might still play him, hard to say.

    I can't wait to see how MacLean handles coaching in the postseason. Bylsma outcoached Clouston in our last postseason appearance so hopefully MacLean can match Torts.

    I would think McClean has more playoff experience with him being in Detroit and all.......

    So you think the 20,000 fans sitting at the Joe are also qualified to coach in the playoffs? Or maybe just the 20 sitting behind the bench?

    What a terrible terrible analogy Facepalm

    And if you stopped reading right there you stopped terribly, terribly too soon.

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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by Jordo on Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:49 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Neither did K-Daug, Klinhammer or DaCosta. And while DaCosta did not stick around, he was good in his first few games. There's nothing wrong (IMO) inserting Silfverberg as a 3rd or 4th line winger in a game or two. Yes, generally you would need an injury for that, and there will certainly be some.

    Let's say Neil isn't ready to go, or maybe re-injures something -- clearly you don't replace Neil with Butler.

    To be honest, I don't think we're going to be seeing Silvferberg over here in any playoff games. Winning a championship with his SEL team is a huge accomplishment, and certainly a grind- I can't imagine Senators staff would want to bring him over immediately after all of that and risk further injury, take away his enjoyment of the achievement, for a couple of potentially meaningless playoff games.

    All of that being said- we might see someone else, who is more rested, arguably higher skilled, and raring to go.

    @ian_mendes
    Mika Zibanejad is also at the rink this morning.

    Ahhhhh! Ahhhhh!
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by dennycrane on Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:09 pm

    New drinking game: everytime Bob Cole says 'Ottawa Sens' take a shot. We will all be hammered by Coach's Corner.

    Dean Brown's quality seems to relate to which broadcast he is working. He brings his 'A' game for HNIC, is OK on Sportsnet, but is horrible on the radio. It turns into the Dean Brown Comedy Hour on radio. Which, as you know, is not funny.
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by dennycrane on Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:10 pm

    Carkner did not practice due to injury today. I will be stunned if both he and Konopka do not play at some point in this series. I think the Sens will need to "push back" against the Rangers by Game 3.

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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by sandysensfan on Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:13 pm

    rooneypoo wrote:
    Riprock wrote:I'd make room for Silfverberg for sure. I'd probably slot him in ahead of Daugavins - not that KD isn't good, but if you can put in a 2-way player like Silfverberg who is probably just as good defensively than KD and better offensively, why wouldn't you?

    Because he's never played an NHL game in his life, maybe?

    Facepalm

    Neither has Kreider (a Rangers top prospect) -- it is rumoured they are signing him and putting him in the lineup... at least Pierre McGuire said that....

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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by sandysensfan on Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:16 pm

    Big Ev wrote:
    Michallica wrote:
    Big Ev wrote:best news: no Dean Brown! Diddle yeah!

    Yay bob Cole?

    Dean brown anyday over that clown.

    Not for me. Dean's a f****ing blowhard. Bob has the playoff voice.

    Bob Cole doesn't even know who half the Sens players are... He seems to just make up names as he goes or gets them mixed up... way sooner have Dean Brown that the Leaf loving duo of Cole & Healey...
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by rooneypoo on Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:46 pm

    sandysensfan wrote:
    rooneypoo wrote:
    Riprock wrote:I'd make room for Silfverberg for sure. I'd probably slot him in ahead of Daugavins - not that KD isn't good, but if you can put in a 2-way player like Silfverberg who is probably just as good defensively than KD and better offensively, why wouldn't you?

    Because he's never played an NHL game in his life, maybe?

    Facepalm

    Neither has Kreider (a Rangers top prospect) -- it is rumoured they are signing him and putting him in the lineup... at least Pierre McGuire said that....

    Not a very definite counter to the point, tho', is it, when you think about it? Smile
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by PTFlea on Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:11 pm

    The way I would look at this series personally is that it's a lot closer than it first appears by the standings.

    You have the sniper on the Rangers, Gaborik, the Sens have a sniper in Michalek - now, granted Gaborik is a more dangerous player than Michalek, but it's comparable. Then you have Jason Spezza vs Brad Richards, which is close, but in the end the ball's in Spezza's court as he's proven to be more valuable this season.

    Things get a little more interesting when you look at Dubinsky and Callahan on line 2 - but Foligno is a tough customer - he doesn't score as much as they do though...Alfie can hold his own against either player. Turris is quite talented, but even though he's had some success in the playoffs before, it'll be a challenge for him to fight through the checking and succeed.

    Where it filters down to is the 3rd and 4th lines. I like Z.Smith, Daugavins, Condra, Winchester, Neil over Mitchell, Prust, Fedentenko - anything the Rangers throw at us.

    Girardi/Staal are probably the top shutdown duo in the league, so we probably don't have an answer to that, but I think the Rangers are gonna get to know Jared Cowen really, really well. Phillips is also perfectly capable of playing a solid D, as is Gonchar - who appears to have a little fire lit under his arse. Karlsson is well ahead of Del Zotto, hopefully Carkner draws in and he can block some shots.

    Anderson is perfectly capable of being solid in net for us, I realize it's Lundqvist and I realize that's he's a lot better, but in a 7 game series, he's gonna let in some goals - especially to us.

    It'll come down to our special teams and being able to match and exceed them physically. Also, don't let anyone say that it's not the Rangers who have all the pressure. They have pressure galore, if they lose this, it'll be a massive upset - and people in NY will be pissed. If we lose, we lose. It was a great season and we did very well.

    I could see a 7 game series coming here, not sure who'll win, it'll be close.
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by wprager on Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:16 pm

    Jordo wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Neither did K-Daug, Klinhammer or DaCosta. And while DaCosta did not stick around, he was good in his first few games. There's nothing wrong (IMO) inserting Silfverberg as a 3rd or 4th line winger in a game or two. Yes, generally you would need an injury for that, and there will certainly be some.

    Let's say Neil isn't ready to go, or maybe re-injures something -- clearly you don't replace Neil with Butler.

    To be honest, I don't think we're going to be seeing Silvferberg over here in any playoff games. Winning a championship with his SEL team is a huge accomplishment, and certainly a grind- I can't imagine Senators staff would want to bring him over immediately after all of that and risk further injury, take away his enjoyment of the achievement, for a couple of potentially meaningless playoff games.

    All of that being said- we might see someone else, who is more rested, arguably higher skilled, and raring to go.

    @ian_mendes
    Mika Zibanejad is also at the rink this morning.

    Ahhhhh! Ahhhhh!

    I've seen Zibanejad play here, and I'd heard about his season in the SEL. At this point in time I'd prefer to see Silfverberg in a game or two. To say that Zibanejad is higher skilled is not an argument you would be able to defend easily.

    The season in the SEL is shorter, as are the playoffs. And the hitting is nowhere near as intensely physical. I highly doubt that Silfverberg is too tired to play a few games.

    Meaningless? Debatable. Silfverberg himself had come out and said he would do it if he was asked.


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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by Ev on Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:26 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Jordo wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Neither did K-Daug, Klinhammer or DaCosta. And while DaCosta did not stick around, he was good in his first few games. There's nothing wrong (IMO) inserting Silfverberg as a 3rd or 4th line winger in a game or two. Yes, generally you would need an injury for that, and there will certainly be some.

    Let's say Neil isn't ready to go, or maybe re-injures something -- clearly you don't replace Neil with Butler.

    To be honest, I don't think we're going to be seeing Silvferberg over here in any playoff games. Winning a championship with his SEL team is a huge accomplishment, and certainly a grind- I can't imagine Senators staff would want to bring him over immediately after all of that and risk further injury, take away his enjoyment of the achievement, for a couple of potentially meaningless playoff games.

    All of that being said- we might see someone else, who is more rested, arguably higher skilled, and raring to go.

    @ian_mendes
    Mika Zibanejad is also at the rink this morning.

    Ahhhhh! Ahhhhh!

    I've seen Zibanejad play here, and I'd heard about his season in the SEL. At this point in time I'd prefer to see Silfverberg in a game or two. To say that Zibanejad is higher skilled is not an argument you would be able to defend easily.

    The season in the SEL is shorter, as are the playoffs. And the hitting is nowhere near as intensely physical. I highly doubt that Silfverberg is too tired to play a few games.

    Meaningless? Debatable. Silfverberg himself had come out and said he would do it if he was asked.

    Zibanejad is higher skilled, he's just not as developed. He's not playing this postseason.
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by wprager on Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:56 pm

    SpezDispenser wrote:The way I would look at this series personally is that it's a lot closer than it first appears by the standings.

    You have the sniper on the Rangers, Gaborik, the Sens have a sniper in Michalek - now, granted Gaborik is a more dangerous player than Michalek, but it's comparable. Then you have Jason Spezza vs Brad Richards, which is close, but in the end the ball's in Spezza's court as he's proven to be more valuable this season.

    Things get a little more interesting when you look at Dubinsky and Callahan on line 2 - but Foligno is a tough customer - he doesn't score as much as they do though...Alfie can hold his own against either player. Turris is quite talented, but even though he's had some success in the playoffs before, it'll be a challenge for him to fight through the checking and succeed.

    Where it filters down to is the 3rd and 4th lines. I like Z.Smith, Daugavins, Condra, Winchester, Neil over Mitchell, Prust, Fedentenko - anything the Rangers throw at us.

    Girardi/Staal are probably the top shutdown duo in the league, so we probably don't have an answer to that, but I think the Rangers are gonna get to know Jared Cowen really, really well. Phillips is also perfectly capable of playing a solid D, as is Gonchar - who appears to have a little fire lit under his arse. Karlsson is well ahead of Del Zotto, hopefully Carkner draws in and he can block some shots.

    Anderson is perfectly capable of being solid in net for us, I realize it's Lundqvist and I realize that's he's a lot better, but in a 7 game series, he's gonna let in some goals - especially to us.

    It'll come down to our special teams and being able to match and exceed them physically. Also, don't let anyone say that it's not the Rangers who have all the pressure. They have pressure galore, if they lose this, it'll be a massive upset - and people in NY will be pissed. If we lose, we lose. It was a great season and we did very well.

    I could see a 7 game series coming here, not sure who'll win, it'll be close.

    Were you listening to Potvin on SNet's playoff preview show? Smile

    Spezza/Michalek have 2 more points than Richards/Gaborik, having played 7 fewer games (5 missed by Michalek and 2 by Spezza). Plus if all other things were equal, I'd take the pair with the higher scoring center, as he is also distributing pucks to the second winger. Who was the other winger on Richards' line?

    That second line is impossible to call. Foligno only has 10 playoff games and Turris just 4, but they are playing alongside Alfie, who's had a lot more post-season success than just being part of the CASH line in 2007. When did Dubinsky get his 22 games in? Wasn't he the #1 center then? Chances are he's not getting nearly the same ice time this year as he did before. And Callahan's numbers in the post-season are less than impressive.

    I agree that we have the edge on the 3rd/4th lines, especially the Calder Cup guys who know what it takes to win in the post-season.

    Shot blocking is a negative for us. Rangers are 7th in the league in number of blocked shots, while the Sens are 20th. They averaged 1.6 blocked shots per game more, and I'm pretty sure the stat is kind to the Sens as pucks deflected by sticks count as blocked shots in many cases. Bottom line, I don't see too many of the Senators willing to put their body in harm's way (like I saw Gilroy do, twice, in the last game). That used to be a big positive for the Sens, and now they are in the bottom third of the league.

    Lundqvist certainly has the experience and reputation over Anderson, but he has never done all that well against the Senators. And he has never done all that well in the playoffs: http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/l/lundqhe01.html

    He has a lifetime SV% of .909, which means that, usually, his stats get worse in the post-season. Odd. Could be the make of the team/coaching, as the Rangers are not known to be a strong playoff team (at least not since the Messier days). Maybe it's the team, maybe it's actually Lundqvist. Very odd, but that's that.

    Anderson has only had one chance in the playoffs and he aced it, posting a .933 SV% in a 6-game loss to the Sharks. I don't think this edition of the Senators is any worse, defensively, than the 2009-10 Avalanche.


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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by wprager on Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:57 pm

    Big Ev wrote:

    Zibanejad is higher skilled, he's just not as developed. He's not playing this postseason.

    What do you base that on?


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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by Flo The Action on Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:58 pm

    I wish i shared the enthusiasm that everyone has on here but I've got to say i'm a little scared about the match up. I guess it really depends which sens team shows up for the playoffs. they can say anything they want to the camera but this season has shown at times a team that didn't show up for games.

    I truly hope that the calder experience translates for our young team but i also feel that it may have show them to be better NHLers and it's actually an extra step then that when you compare it to NHL playoffs.

    Let's hope the vets show that extra step that can light a fire under the whole team. it coud be a close one i admit, but lot's is gotta happen for it to work. I ain't taking any bets.
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by PTFlea on Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:12 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Were you listening to Potvin on SNet's playoff preview show? Smile

    Spezza/Michalek have 2 more points than Richards/Gaborik, having played 7 fewer games (5 missed by Michalek and 2 by Spezza). Plus if all other things were equal, I'd take the pair with the higher scoring center, as he is also distributing pucks to the second winger. Who was the other winger on Richards' line?

    That second line is impossible to call. Foligno only has 10 playoff games and Turris just 4, but they are playing alongside Alfie, who's had a lot more post-season success than just being part of the CASH line in 2007. When did Dubinsky get his 22 games in? Wasn't he the #1 center then? Chances are he's not getting nearly the same ice time this year as he did before. And Callahan's numbers in the post-season are less than impressive.

    I agree that we have the edge on the 3rd/4th lines, especially the Calder Cup guys who know what it takes to win in the post-season.

    Shot blocking is a negative for us. Rangers are 7th in the league in number of blocked shots, while the Sens are 20th. They averaged 1.6 blocked shots per game more, and I'm pretty sure the stat is kind to the Sens as pucks deflected by sticks count as blocked shots in many cases. Bottom line, I don't see too many of the Senators willing to put their body in harm's way (like I saw Gilroy do, twice, in the last game). That used to be a big positive for the Sens, and now they are in the bottom third of the league.

    Lundqvist certainly has the experience and reputation over Anderson, but he has never done all that well against the Senators. And he has never done all that well in the playoffs: http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/l/lundqhe01.html

    He has a lifetime SV% of .909, which means that, usually, his stats get worse in the post-season. Odd. Could be the make of the team/coaching, as the Rangers are not known to be a strong playoff team (at least not since the Messier days). Maybe it's the team, maybe it's actually Lundqvist. Very odd, but that's that.

    Anderson has only had one chance in the playoffs and he aced it, posting a .933 SV% in a 6-game loss to the Sharks. I don't think this edition of the Senators is any worse, defensively, than the 2009-10 Avalanche.

    I haven't really read anything yet to be honest. I don't really put too much stock in what the so called 'experts' say. They really have struggled badly in the last couple of years trying to analyse these series (and the seasons themselves).
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by Ev on Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:16 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Big Ev wrote:

    Zibanejad is higher skilled, he's just not as developed. He's not playing this postseason.

    What do you base that on?

    Which part?
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by Jordo on Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:23 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Jordo wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Neither did K-Daug, Klinhammer or DaCosta. And while DaCosta did not stick around, he was good in his first few games. There's nothing wrong (IMO) inserting Silfverberg as a 3rd or 4th line winger in a game or two. Yes, generally you would need an injury for that, and there will certainly be some.

    Let's say Neil isn't ready to go, or maybe re-injures something -- clearly you don't replace Neil with Butler.

    To be honest, I don't think we're going to be seeing Silvferberg over here in any playoff games. Winning a championship with his SEL team is a huge accomplishment, and certainly a grind- I can't imagine Senators staff would want to bring him over immediately after all of that and risk further injury, take away his enjoyment of the achievement, for a couple of potentially meaningless playoff games.

    All of that being said- we might see someone else, who is more rested, arguably higher skilled, and raring to go.

    @ian_mendes
    Mika Zibanejad is also at the rink this morning.

    Ahhhhh! Ahhhhh!

    I've seen Zibanejad play here, and I'd heard about his season in the SEL. At this point in time I'd prefer to see Silfverberg in a game or two. To say that Zibanejad is higher skilled is not an argument you would be able to defend easily.

    The season in the SEL is shorter, as are the playoffs. And the hitting is nowhere near as intensely physical. I highly doubt that Silfverberg is too tired to play a few games.

    Meaningless? Debatable. Silfverberg himself had come out and said he would do it if he was asked.

    My perspective is that the playoffs this year are a bonus. I think that this matchup is quite favourable to us, at least relatively speaking to the Bruins, but I really can't see us moving further than 2nd round. Call that pessimistic, I see it as realistic. I'm clearly still rooting hard for the Sens to win all of these games.

    My position on Silvferberg is that celebrating a huge accomplishment with your team is nearly as important as the process in getting there. The Sens aren't really in a position to make a deep run this year, so in my opinion you should allow Silfverberg the opportunity to properly celebrate with his teammates. Combined with the fact that the roster players on this team contributed to the position they are currently in, and deserve to be rewarded for their efforts. Remember this is a rebuilding year- experience is experience- and this playoff experience should be resonated throughout the locker room to all players who made this happen.

    In short- Do people truthfully think that the addition of Silfverberg is going to put us over the top against a team like Pittsburgh or New Jersey? I understand that the hype behind this kid is unreal, and people are all flared up to get him over here asap- but I can't see it. I'd rather give that opportunity to Zibanejad, who is over here already, rested, and hungry to make an impact.
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    Re: (1) New York Rangers vs (8) Ottawa Senators - Playoffs Round 1

    Post by wprager on Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:31 pm

    wprager wrote:
    Big Ev wrote:

    Zibanejad is higher skilled, he's just not as developed. He's not playing this postseason.

    What do you base that on?

    I asked SteffeG for his opinion if it would be fair to say Zibanejad has a higher skill level:

    Stefan G:son ‏ @steffeG
    @MrMontagoose I don't think so, but he tries more difficult stuff in a higher tempo. Silfverberg a better passer, shooter.

    Given that, plus their relative location on the learning curve, I'd definitely give the advantage to Silfverberg. Zibanejad's 9 games in the NHL have done little more than confirm he was not ready.


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