RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

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    PTFlea
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by PTFlea on Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:40 pm

    Riprock wrote:Apparently the accused perpetrator told police he was The Joker.

    Holy cow, this Dungball didn't kill himself?

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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by Riprock on Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:42 pm

    No he apparently walked out of the theatre and stood outside, armed, and waited to be arrested.

    These tragedies are an unfortunate catch-22: the people often do it, not just because they are insane, but also because they want the attention and infamy; but with out media attention, many of us wouldn't know.

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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by shabbs on Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:00 pm

    Riprock wrote:I only know about NY doing that from an episode of 30 Rock. They started that after 9/11 right? And it applies to everyone, and is similar to "random" airport security checks.

    Yeah, if you're looking suspicious and hanging on a corner in a bad area in the wee hours of the night or whenever... the cops can walk up, question you and if they don't like your answers, they can frisk you. Doesn't matter your colour, but you know certain areas will be targeted that are known for "bad activity". If Toronto tries to do something like that, it will have a lot of push back from various groups. But given the violence escalation lately and the success in NY, it may have legs.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by shabbs on Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:05 pm

    Riprock wrote:No he apparently walked out of the theatre and stood outside, armed, and waited to be arrested.

    These tragedies are an unfortunate catch-22: the people often do it, not just because they are insane, but also because they want the attention and infamy; but with out media attention, many of us wouldn't know.
    Sounds like that guy that went on rampage in Norway. When SWAT showed up he just surrendered.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by spader on Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:00 pm

    shabbs wrote:Here in TO, one councillor (Adam Vaughn) has been pushing for a ban on bullets. I'm mean really. We have bans for pretty much everything, they don't help. More cops, more enforcement, way harsher crimes, more raids, more pressure... gotta make these guys think twice.

    There is talk of a "stop and frisk" rule to let Cops search "suspect youth" to see if they have illegal weapons. NY has done this and they say it's been a huge success. That's getting into a grey area with civil rights, profiling etc... and will cause a big debate.

    More punishment doesn't necessarily equal less crime, at least not in North America. In fact, many experts say that we need more programs (social, education, drug dependency, etc) and less police presence.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by shabbs on Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:39 pm

    spader wrote:
    shabbs wrote:Here in TO, one councillor (Adam Vaughn) has been pushing for a ban on bullets. I'm mean really. We have bans for pretty much everything, they don't help. More cops, more enforcement, way harsher crimes, more raids, more pressure... gotta make these guys think twice.

    There is talk of a "stop and frisk" rule to let Cops search "suspect youth" to see if they have illegal weapons. NY has done this and they say it's been a huge success. That's getting into a grey area with civil rights, profiling etc... and will cause a big debate.

    More punishment doesn't necessarily equal less crime, at least not in North America. In fact, many experts say that we need more programs (social, education, drug dependency, etc) and less police presence.
    Agree with the social programs etc... there's no silver bullet... it's a complex situation that needs a multi-pronged solution. Better relations with police, community involvement, stability at home etc... are all factors.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by Riprock on Fri Jul 20, 2012 10:20 pm

    Ah yes, the hardening of criminals. Goes back to ancient Greek philosophy in the Republic and how doing harm to people makes them more vicious.

    Basically everyone has an opinion and a suggestion, and a lot of them are knee jerk reactions.

    Bottom line, this and every other tragedy like it, are awful and unthinkable, but people can't be so quick to react and blame the media, or call for banning firearms, etc.

    This guy is already paving the way for an insanity plea.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by PTFlea on Fri Jul 20, 2012 10:32 pm

    I hate that thought...

    If he's insane, then let's get him to a maximum security facility and get him some help, but I hope he doesn't think he's getting off - ever. I'm not sure why this kind of thing rubs me so badly the wrong way when people are shot every day. There's something random and arbitrary about this that yells that one of us could have been there - or worse, our kids could have been there and these Cussing bunghole are running around with weapons thinking they can shoot up the place and take lives because they're the 'Joker'. Go Diddle yourself Holmes, you should have been a man and shot yourself way before it came to taking 12 lives.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by wprager on Sat Jul 21, 2012 8:31 am

    My sister lives in Texas. Got remarried to a guy from Colorado. When I met him for the first time he wanted to show me his gun collection. My sister still had her kids living in the house at the time. Guns may not kill people, but they make it so much easier for people to kill.


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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by shabbs on Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:14 am

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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by shabbs on Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:17 am

    Riprock wrote:Basically everyone has an opinion and a suggestion, and a lot of them are knee jerk reactions.
    Any time there is a major event like this, it always sparks that kind of discussion and the politicians get in front of the camera and bark crap about banning this and banning that etc...
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by Riprock on Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:07 am

    Soap box to get re-elected/elected.

    Pretty sure the US gov't would lose money on the banning of firerarms.


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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by sandysensfan on Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:53 pm

    But it says in the US constitution -- that their citizens 'have the right to bear arms'.

    Everytime something like this tragedy happens.. the NRA goes back to that.

    Point is.. that is about 400 yrs old.

    They have to make it harder for their citizens to get the guns. This guy bought 4 of them. Now if there was some kind of way they have to register whenever they buy guns -- would you not think he was up to something buying that many in a short period of time?

    People hunt and have shotguns. US citizens are allowed hand guns.

    But why the hell are they selling assault rifles? That makes no sense to me at all?

    They need to get with the times... or over and over again.. some nut will keep doing these types of shootings. How long can they let this go on?
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by Cap'n Clutch on Mon Jul 23, 2012 7:34 am

    I went to see the Dark Knight Rises last night and my thoughts kept turning back to the victims. Terrible tragedy.


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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by Riprock on Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:27 am

    That's too bad. It's a good movie, hope you at least enjoyed it. I know it's hard to think that a dozen people died while in the same position as you.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by wprager on Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:49 am

    sandysensfan wrote:But it says in the US constitution -- that their citizens 'have the right to bear arms'.

    Everytime something like this tragedy happens.. the NRA goes back to that.

    Point is.. that is about 400 yrs old.

    They have to make it harder for their citizens to get the guns. This guy bought 4 of them. Now if there was some kind of way they have to register whenever they buy guns -- would you not think he was up to something buying that many in a short period of time?

    People hunt and have shotguns. US citizens are allowed hand guns.

    But why the hell are they selling assault rifles? That makes no sense to me at all?

    They need to get with the times... or over and over again.. some nut will keep doing these types of shootings. How long can they let this go on?

    Jason Alexander ('George' from Seinfeld) had a tweetlonger post on this. If you follow MrMontagoose on twitter I replied to it. He made quite a few points, not least of which is the fact that the Constitution was specifically talking about "organized militia" and not just ordinary citizens. Also, like you said, the definition of "arms" 400 years ago surely did not include assault rifles.


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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by Riprock on Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:35 am

    I read his post, he raised some very good points. It seems to be a misinterpreted constitution.
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    Re: RIP victims of the Dark Knight Rises Colorado tragedy

    Post by spader on Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:48 am

    wprager wrote:
    sandysensfan wrote:But it says in the US constitution -- that their citizens 'have the right to bear arms'.

    Everytime something like this tragedy happens.. the NRA goes back to that.

    Point is.. that is about 400 yrs old.

    They have to make it harder for their citizens to get the guns. This guy bought 4 of them. Now if there was some kind of way they have to register whenever they buy guns -- would you not think he was up to something buying that many in a short period of time?

    People hunt and have shotguns. US citizens are allowed hand guns.

    But why the hell are they selling assault rifles? That makes no sense to me at all?

    They need to get with the times... or over and over again.. some nut will keep doing these types of shootings. How long can they let this go on?

    Jason Alexander ('George' from Seinfeld) had a tweetlonger post on this. If you follow MrMontagoose on twitter I replied to it. He made quite a few points, not least of which is the fact that the Constitution was specifically talking about "organized militia" and not just ordinary citizens. Also, like you said, the definition of "arms" 400 years ago surely did not include assault rifles.

    I haven't read it yet, but JA posted this rebuttal to his original post:

    http://www.grumpypundit.com/index.php/2012/07/22/we-wont-be-fooled-again-oh-hell-yes-we-will/

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