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The Sens after 20

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16 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:26 pm

wprager


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tim1_2 wrote:
wprager wrote:As for Lazar, he was great the last couple of games, playing on the 4th line.  And I'm not sure that's a good thing.  He needs to find some scoring success in this league; he is not meant to replace Condra.

Actually, Lazar might be exactly meant to replace Condra.  I think we all hoped his upside would be that of a 2nd liner with some scoring ability, but his current role is more suited to his skill set it seems.

Their coveted 1st round pick replacing a $1M 4th liner? Nah, I don't think that was quite the plan.

I thought his upside would be more of a 3rd line player, actually, with grit and leadership. Right now Pageau is outplaying him for that 3LC role and he's not producing enough points for a 3rd line winger.

To be perfectly honest here, he should be in Bingo with an 'A' on his jersey playing 2nd line minutes plus PP/PK time.

17 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:39 pm

Flo The Action


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wprager wrote:I agree about the standings.  We are where we are because the Atlantic is a hot mess.  Who would have thunk it that Tampa would have such a huge hangover?  Or that Boston would be at the top of the league (or near there) in goals per game and PP and yet be where they are in the standings?  Up is down.  White is black.  Habs are on the way to another Presiden't Choice Trophy (Memories of Stanley).  Makes so little sense, sometimes.  And, of course, we are a 3 game losing streak of being on the outside, looking in.

All that said, however, I am perplexed about the PK.  We have above average goaltending overall, but below average on the PK.  Combine that with taking too many penalties in the first place and it's a wonder we're not in a place where we'd be eyeing the panic button.  One of the Sens' bloggers did a very detailed analysis of the PK numbers, using various team and individual advanced stats and comparing those to last year.  Other than losing Gryba and Condra, it's the same personnel.  But just losing those two does not begin to explain it.  Pretty much everyone's numbers are worse than last year.  We need to be around the 90% mark, not the 77% we are at now or, worse, the 74% we were two games ago.  
Well you might want to loom at how bad our D can be on the PK. Its a factor to our bad percentage. Our D gets knocked too easily off the puck.

18 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:43 pm

tim1_2


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Here's Button's take:

http://www.tsn.ca/ottawa-a-solid-first-quarter-but-management-expects-more-1.398527

19 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:38 pm

PTFlea

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I'm actually slightly disappointed so far - which is a good thing, I think.  There's so much room to improve, it's silly.  No need to harp on things that have been well summarised so far, but the defence - outside of Ceci, Karlsson (who is starting to get there), Boro (who is a number 6 guy and nothing more) and Methot are all awful.  That's a massive hole in the third spot - ie, a guy who should be logging ~20 minutes a night.  Where do those minutes go?  To Wiercioch and/or Cowen, both of whom are proving to be number 5 guys - and with Cowen, his CORSI is horrendous.

Also, Lazar is playing a solid defensive game, but by now there's usually a sign of offense and it's not inspiring to think that he's a Condra replacement.  With guys like White coming up through the ranks, if he's gonna show some offense at the NHL level, now would be good.

I sort of feel the same way about Pageau, but he's shown he can contribute somewhat offensively.  I think some of us are waiting for Pageau to take the next step offensively, but that might require different linemates.

The rest of the forwards are taking steps forward, Stone, Hoffman, Turris, Ryan and even ZBad is starting to find a rhythm.  Goaltending is steady as she goes as well.

20 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:42 pm

SeawaySensFan

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tim1_2 wrote:
wprager wrote:As for Lazar, he was great the last couple of games, playing on the 4th line.  And I'm not sure that's a good thing.  He needs to find some scoring success in this league; he is not meant to replace Condra.

Actually, Lazar might be exactly meant to replace Condra. I think we all hoped his upside would be that of a 2nd liner with some scoring ability, but his current role is more suited to his skill set it seems.

Seems reasonable.

21 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:54 pm

Flo The Action

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tim1_2 wrote:Here's Button's take:

http://www.tsn.ca/ottawa-a-solid-first-quarter-but-management-expects-more-1.398527


Ot bad for button.for the most part hes pretty dead on.

"I dont often agree with button but when i do it's cause he's right"
Dos equis

22 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:05 pm

SeawaySensFan

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Flo The Action wrote:
tim1_2 wrote:Here's Button's take:

http://www.tsn.ca/ottawa-a-solid-first-quarter-but-management-expects-more-1.398527


Ot bad for button.for the most part hes pretty dead on.

"I dont often agree with button but when i do it's cause he's right"
Dos equis


Button is kind of quirky and makes up his own mind about players. An outside the box kind of guy I happen to like.

23 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:59 pm

LeCaptain

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We're Cussing awesome.

24 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 8:10 pm

Ev

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LeCaptain wrote:We're Cussing awesome.

Love the Keith Richwrds picture

25 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 9:55 pm

wprager

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Flo The Action wrote:
wprager wrote:I agree about the standings.  We are where we are because the Atlantic is a hot mess.  Who would have thunk it that Tampa would have such a huge hangover?  Or that Boston would be at the top of the league (or near there) in goals per game and PP and yet be where they are in the standings?  Up is down.  White is black.  Habs are on the way to another Presiden't Choice Trophy (Memories of Stanley).  Makes so little sense, sometimes.  And, of course, we are a 3 game losing streak of being on the outside, looking in.

All that said, however, I am perplexed about the PK.  We have above average goaltending overall, but below average on the PK.  Combine that with taking too many penalties in the first place and it's a wonder we're not in a place where we'd be eyeing the panic button.  One of the Sens' bloggers did a very detailed analysis of the PK numbers, using various team and individual advanced stats and comparing those to last year.  Other than losing Gryba and Condra, it's the same personnel.  But just losing those two does not begin to explain it.  Pretty much everyone's numbers are worse than last year.  We need to be around the 90% mark, not the 77% we are at now or, worse, the 74% we were two games ago.  
Well you might want to loom at how bad our D can be on the PK. Its a factor to our bad percentage. Our D gets knocked too easily off the puck.

Fine, but the difference between last year and this year is no more Gryba. Also Methot has about 30% of our PP time, as compared with around 18% last year (since he was injured for a third of the season). So no Gryba and more Methot made our D play worse on the PK? You realize that makes no sense, right?


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Hey, I don't have all the answers. In life, to be honest, I've failed as much as I have succeeded. But I love my wife. I love my life. And I wish you my kind of success.
- Dicky Fox

26 Re: The Sens after 20 on Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:24 pm

wprager

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tim1_2 wrote:Here's Button's take:

http://www.tsn.ca/ottawa-a-solid-first-quarter-but-management-expects-more-1.398527


Since expectations and salary contribute to the grade, he's got Hoffman too low. Now way should Turris be a B+ when he's making 43% more in salary. Stone has the same point total but his +/- is a full 8 points lower (while the salary is that same 43% higher).

Cowen is +5 while playing with Borowiecki (who is a minus); Ceci is -4. Expectation-wise I actually expected a lot more from Ceci and less from Cowen, although his salary will bring him down. I'm a bit surprised Cowen is a D.

Chiasson and Neil have the same stats but Neil's salary is 58% higher, yet Chiasson is a D and Neil a C?

I agree with his "Inc" grades because he defined what that was (10 games for skaters, 5 for goalies) but most of the rest does not really make sense based on the description.


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Hey, I don't have all the answers. In life, to be honest, I've failed as much as I have succeeded. But I love my wife. I love my life. And I wish you my kind of success.
- Dicky Fox

27 Re: The Sens after 20 on Tue Nov 24, 2015 9:43 am

Flo The Action

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wprager wrote:
tim1_2 wrote:Here's Button's take:

http://www.tsn.ca/ottawa-a-solid-first-quarter-but-management-expects-more-1.398527


Since expectations and salary contribute to the grade, he's got Hoffman too low.  Now way should Turris be a B+ when he's making 43% more in salary.  Stone has the same point total but his +/- is a full 8 points lower (while the salary is that same 43% higher).

Cowen is +5 while playing with Borowiecki (who is a minus); Ceci is -4.  Expectation-wise I actually expected a lot more from Ceci and less from Cowen, although his salary will bring him down.  I'm a bit surprised Cowen is a D.

Chiasson and Neil have the same stats but Neil's salary is 58% higher, yet Chiasson is a D and Neil a C?

I agree with his "Inc" grades because he defined what that was (10 games for skaters, 5 for goalies) but most of the rest does not really make sense based on the description.
I think its more to do with expectations also if you compare neil and chiasson.

28 Re: The Sens after 20 on Tue Nov 24, 2015 11:36 pm

LeCaptain

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Ev wrote:
LeCaptain wrote:We're Cussing awesome.

Love the Keith Richwrds picture

that's Slash but love both equally RocknRoll

29 Re: The Sens after 20 on Tue Nov 24, 2015 11:55 pm

PTFlea

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He must have been joking...

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