Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

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    Oglethorpe
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by Oglethorpe on Wed Jan 27, 2016 10:57 am

    My only concern about the Devcore proposal is that they say the Event Centre can be built anytime or not at all, which changes the look of their design. Aquarium would be sweet though.

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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by Hoags on Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:28 am

    If history is any indication, Melnyk will lose as none of his past proposals have gotten off the ground.  Even more so if the other guys have connections.

    I can't find any images of the Devcore bid, but Melnyk's proposal looks practical and realistic. I hope he wins, the Sens need to move downtown.

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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by tim1_2 on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:11 pm

    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess. The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by SeawaySensFan on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:14 pm

    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by Ev on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:20 pm

    Hoags wrote:If history is any indication, Melnyk will lose as none of his past proposals have gotten off the ground.  Even more so if the other guys have connections.

    I can't find any images of the Devcore bid, but Melnyk's proposal looks practical and realistic.  I hope he wins, the Sens need to move downtown.

    well the city isn't deciding this time.

    anyways like I was saying the Sens will move there no matter what IMO
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by tim1_2 on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:24 pm

    Ev wrote:
    Hoags wrote:If history is any indication, Melnyk will lose as none of his past proposals have gotten off the ground.  Even more so if the other guys have connections.

    I can't find any images of the Devcore bid, but Melnyk's proposal looks practical and realistic.  I hope he wins, the Sens need to move downtown.

    well the city isn't deciding this time.

    anyways like I was saying the Sens will move there no matter what IMO

    Yeah, it's a foregone conclusion that the Sens are moving. Which means it's Melnyk's bid that will be chosen, or he's selling the team to Devcore.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by TheAvatar on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:29 pm

    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B. it'll cost $175M just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by SeawaySensFan on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:33 pm

    TheAvatar wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B.  it'll cost $175M  just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)

    There's actually a range of estimates running from 50 to 300 for the clean up which is absurd even on the low end to haul away dirt, as you say.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by tim1_2 on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:40 pm

    TheAvatar wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B.  it'll cost $175M  just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)

    I thought we were talking about the value of the Sens..?
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by wprager on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:44 pm

    Ev wrote:
    wprager wrote:My brother in law is spending more and more of his free time on Maine where he has two houses. He is not pathetic, just busy nearing retirement.

    Fair enough, that is excellent. Just saying if you complain about the commute from bear brook to ctc, you're just complaining for th sake of complaining. It's ten minutes tops.

    "Beaverbrook" is the oldest part of Kanata. It was not the commute he was complaining about it's the commitment to 43 games a year. Between his kids (and their friends), his staff, me -- he probably gave away more than half of the tickets anyway. Apart from the cost, I personally just find it extremely difficult to find the time for even a handful of games per year. When the kids are all grown up I *may* consider a quarter-season type of deal. 10 games.

    Anyhow, back on-point, if other current season ticket holders are in a similar situation (getting older, ready to retire, enjoying the game as much or more from the comfort of their couch) then the added extra drive will easily push them over the edge.

    And that's OK, I'm sure Melnyk has already researched all of that. They will get new fans/supporters, but they will lose a big chunk of exiting ones. Do you really think that Barrhaven residents that didn't buy tickets before because of the drive will suddenly become season ticket holders? I think you will have more people buying occasional tickets but I don't know if you will suddenly get a lot of new season ticket holders.

    And I absolutely guarantee that prices will be going up. Maybe not the first year, but very soon after that.


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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by SeawaySensFan on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:47 pm

    tim1_2 wrote:
    TheAvatar wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B.  it'll cost $175M  just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)

    I thought we were talking about the value of the Sens..?

    That's right.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by tim1_2 on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:49 pm

    Walter, there's zero point in arguing that this will be anything but good for attendance and the fan base in general. Yeah, a bunch of Kanata/Stittsville season ticket holders will give up their tickets, but they'll be easily replaced and then some.

    And of course prices will go up. This is a *good* thing for the team, but bad for us far-west-enders.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by wprager on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:51 pm

    Oglethorpe wrote:My only concern about the Devcore proposal is that they say the Event Centre can be built anytime or not at all, which changes the look of their design.  Aquarium would be sweet though.

    Meh, every Pet Smart and a few Chinese restaurants have aquariums. Hell, there's even a cable channel. The sky diving thing is definitely cool but it can't handle volume.


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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by SeawaySensFan on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:52 pm

    tim1_2 wrote:Walter, there's zero point in arguing that this will be anything but good for attendance and the fan base in general.  Yeah, a bunch of Kanata/Stittsville season ticket holders will give up their tickets, but they'll be easily replaced and then some.

    And of course prices will go up.  This is a *good* thing for the team, but bad for us far-west-enders.

    It sucks that ticket prices will go up but the novelty of a new rink will sustain for a little while, anyway. Hopefully a winning product will sustain it even further.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by wprager on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:54 pm

    TheAvatar wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B.  it'll cost $175M  just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)

    Well the NCC was claiming it would take $300M to clean it up, so whatever the price they want Melnyk has to ask them to drop it by $300M since they'll be doing the cleanup.

    It's ridiculous to talk about "market value" when it's been an eyesore and an industrial dump for several decades, and when they finally opened it up to bids only two parties showed interest. That is the market right there. And the value should be zero, since they will reap millions in taxes and tourism.


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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by TheAvatar on Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:17 pm

    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    TheAvatar wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B.  it'll cost $175M  just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)

    I thought we were talking about the value of the Sens..?

    That's right.

    Oh. My bad. I think Forbes evaluated the franchise at $380M. I'm thinking if someone was to offer old 'Gene $550-600M he'd fade into the sunset ... Smile
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by Flo The Action on Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:34 pm

    wprager wrote:
    TheAvatar wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SeawaySensFan wrote:I'm guessing the price is around 1/2 a BILL US.

    That would be my guess.  The fact that the team is moving downtown really increases the value....


    Make it 3/4 then. It's only money.

    yeah, gotta be more then 1/2B.  it'll cost $175M  just to clean up the site (haul away dirt)

    Well the NCC was claiming it would take $300M to clean it up, so whatever the price they want Melnyk has to ask them to drop it by $300M since they'll be doing the cleanup.

    It's ridiculous to talk about "market value" when it's been an eyesore and an industrial dump for several decades, and when they finally opened it up to bids only two parties showed interest.  That is the market right there.  And the value should be zero, since they will reap millions in taxes and tourism.
    I think you have to look at the magnitude of the project. Not every entrepreneurial group can put together such bids. Also you have to realize that the arena is key to development and that drives away people.

    Personally I would walk away from any investor group that involves guy laliberté. That guy is dodgy. His cirque du soleil empire has taken a major dive after 2008 and is very volatile to fluctuations in the economy. If this is a ploy to wrestle the hockey team away from Melnyk then I would be worried of the cash flows he'd want to invest in times of economic hardship.
    Nope.
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    Re: Lebreton Flats Redevelopment

    Post by wprager on Thu Jan 28, 2016 10:16 am

    So the DevCorp group said that if they win the bid they are willing to discuss terms with the Senators about letting them build/own the arena.


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