GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

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    spader
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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by spader on Sat Mar 19, 2016 2:26 pm

    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SpezDispensed wrote:I agree that wholesale changes are coming.  We're not prepared to start games,  the conditioning appears poor.I doubt that majority of fans out there will he content with minor changes

    You're crazy if you think there will be big changes. Cameron is sticking around, and we'll have probably two different roster players next year. Keep in mind we were a playoff team until Turris got hurt. He's very important to this team.

    Even though we were in a playoff spot (hell, we were a point back of Detroit for 2nd in the Atlantic with a game in hand) we were playing very poorly from a possession point of view.  The analytics nerds were correct in saying that our team PDO (SV% plus SH%) were not sustainable.  Giving up that many shots on goal would eventually lead to problems when our shooting percentage and goalies' save percentages regressed to the mean.

    If Turris hadn't gotten injured, even MacArthur stayed healthy, we would have made the playoffs, sure.  Very possibly even gotten home ice advantage in the first round.  But we would have trouble getting past the first round.

    This team has already moved Michalek, Greening and Cowen from the roster.  Good chance that Wiercioch will not be qualified, either.  One (if not both) of Hoffman and Smith will likely be playing on a different team.  This team will be very different from the one that had that miracle run last year.

    Cameron only got a 1 year extension and Murray hasn't decided yet if he'll be back.  I'm not entirely convinced that returning is *his* choice.  
    didn't Cameron get a two year?

    According to this site (who knew this info was available? I didn't) http://www.otherleague.com/contracts/nhl-head-coach-contracts-salaries/ Cameron has 2 years left.



    It goes team, head coach, years left, salary (when available), former HC

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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by spader on Sat Mar 19, 2016 2:29 pm

    Flo The Action wrote:
    SpezDispensed wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    SpezDispensed wrote:What's disappointing are these silly little winning streaks we have when we're out of it.  We need a star forward other than Stone and maybe Turris.

    It's sad when Eichel is better than any of your forwards.
    I don't think Bobby Ryan is "the" key to put him over the top but I'm quite happy to have him. A bit overpaid for what he brings at this point but if zib would reach his potential I'm sure it would show with helping Ryan.  He's much better when playing with a good center. I think his best stretch this season was with Turris.  We need a shake up for sure and an injection of talent.

    I hope he improves next year is all I can say.  Very disappointing.
    Every year that's what we all say. Let's match him with a centre(on more than 20 games, uhum turris) with which he can build chemistry with. Ryan hasn't been handled in the best possible way if you ask me. Cameron juggles so much he should get a red nose.

    Hoffman-Turris-Ryan as the top line for the first 20 games?


    Could go with this:

    Hoff-Turris-Ryan
    Mac-Zbad-Stone
    Smith-JGP-Dzingel
    Paul-Lazar-Neil
    Chiasson

    That spreads the scoring out fairly well. I don't know if Dzingel is the best option for that 3RW spot, but if JGP and Smith can play anywhere where they're playing this season, they'll be in fine shape on that line. I like having Stone on the second line. I think he can play with anyone. He's one of those players that doesn't need a "good center to get him going" like some people. He elevates the game of others around him. This would be an experiment to see if Ryan can perform under optimal circumstances. If he can't, they need to figure out what to do about him, cause that contract demands results.

    Chiasson is the guy that fits in the least, IMO. He's likely to swap in and out with Neil. Obviously this is assuming Murray stands pat.

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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by spader on Sat Mar 19, 2016 2:46 pm

    Trade: Zbad, Wiercioch, prospect for Drouin

    Sign: Stamkos (because why not)

    Hoffman-Stamkos-Ryan
    Drouin-Turris-Stone
    Smith-JGP-MacArthur
    Paul-Lazar-Neil
    Chiasson/Dzingel

    I have Mac on the wrong side, but I think that line is competitive enough that they could cover that up, or he could be trade bait. There are a log of decent options for RWs in FA this off-season as well. Brouwer, Okposo, Stempniak are all available on the right side.

    *Disclaimer* I do not believe the Sens will be signing Stamkos (and I know lots of you are wary about him), but you can't blame a guy for dreaming.
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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by wprager on Sat Mar 19, 2016 3:11 pm

    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    tim1_2 wrote:
    SpezDispensed wrote:I agree that wholesale changes are coming.  We're not prepared to start games,  the conditioning appears poor.I doubt that majority of fans out there will he content with minor changes

    You're crazy if you think there will be big changes. Cameron is sticking around, and we'll have probably two different roster players next year. Keep in mind we were a playoff team until Turris got hurt. He's very important to this team.

    Even though we were in a playoff spot (hell, we were a point back of Detroit for 2nd in the Atlantic with a game in hand) we were playing very poorly from a possession point of view.  The analytics nerds were correct in saying that our team PDO (SV% plus SH%) were not sustainable.  Giving up that many shots on goal would eventually lead to problems when our shooting percentage and goalies' save percentages regressed to the mean.

    If Turris hadn't gotten injured, even MacArthur stayed healthy, we would have made the playoffs, sure.  Very possibly even gotten home ice advantage in the first round.  But we would have trouble getting past the first round.

    This team has already moved Michalek, Greening and Cowen from the roster.  Good chance that Wiercioch will not be qualified, either.  One (if not both) of Hoffman and Smith will likely be playing on a different team.  This team will be very different from the one that had that miracle run last year.

    Cameron only got a 1 year extension and Murray hasn't decided yet if he'll be back.  I'm not entirely convinced that returning is *his* choice.  
    didn't Cameron get a two year?

    Don't cloud a biased rant with facts, what's wrong with you!


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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by wprager on Sat Mar 19, 2016 3:15 pm

    spader wrote:I like having Stone on the second line. I think he can play with anyone. He's one of those players that doesn't need a "good center to get him going" like some people. He elevates the game of others around him.

    When Stone came back from serving his suspension he was pretty bad. Then, just as he was starting to come around Turris got injured and Stone was pretty awful.


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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by spader on Sat Mar 19, 2016 3:42 pm

    wprager wrote:
    spader wrote:I like having Stone on the second line. I think he can play with anyone. He's one of those players that doesn't need a "good center to get him going" like some people. He elevates the game of others around him.

    When Stone came back from serving his suspension he was pretty bad.  Then, just as he was starting to come around Turris got injured and Stone was pretty awful.  

    When you focus on negatives, you'll always find them. I think he's been great. He has some consistency issues to resolve, but what young player doesn't?
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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by Flo The Action on Sat Mar 19, 2016 8:14 pm

    spader wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    SpezDispensed wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    SpezDispensed wrote:What's disappointing are these silly little winning streaks we have when we're out of it.  We need a star forward other than Stone and maybe Turris.

    It's sad when Eichel is better than any of your forwards.
    I don't think Bobby Ryan is "the" key to put him over the top but I'm quite happy to have him. A bit overpaid for what he brings at this point but if zib would reach his potential I'm sure it would show with helping Ryan.  He's much better when playing with a good center. I think his best stretch this season was with Turris.  We need a shake up for sure and an injection of talent.

    I hope he improves next year is all I can say.  Very disappointing.
    Every year that's what we all say. Let's match him with a centre(on more than 20 games, uhum turris) with which he can build chemistry with. Ryan hasn't been handled in the best possible way if you ask me. Cameron juggles so much he should get a red nose.

    Hoffman-Turris-Ryan as the top line for the first 20 games?


    Could go with this:

    Hoff-Turris-Ryan
    Mac-Zbad-Stone
    Smith-JGP-Dzingel
    Paul-Lazar-Neil
    Chiasson

    That spreads the scoring out fairly well. I don't know if Dzingel is the best option for that 3RW spot, but if JGP and Smith can play anywhere where they're playing this season, they'll be in fine shape on that line. I like having Stone on the second line. I think he can play with anyone. He's one of those players that doesn't need a "good center to get him going" like some people. He elevates the game of others around him. This would be an experiment to see if Ryan can perform under optimal circumstances. If he can't, they need to figure out what to do about him, cause that contract demands results.

    Chiasson is the guy that fits in the least, IMO. He's likely to swap in and out with Neil. Obviously this is assuming Murray stands pat.
    I like the arrangement of your lines with what we have but that still puts us as an average team. The fact remains that we need some upgrades on the top 6. The other factor is any injury on D in the top 4 leaves us deficient and unable to really compete. I was hassling SpezD about his obsession with adding a Damn but he's got a point. We need someone that can move up into the top 4 that is reliable. Left or right doesn't matter because phaneuf can switch (as long as he's not the one injured). But budget wise is where it makes it hard. A guy like Oduya would of been right.
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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by Oglethorpe on Sat Mar 19, 2016 10:38 pm

    Paul should spend next year in the AHL playing centre. I hate this management groups philosophy of letting players develop in the NHL. I think it stunts their potential. Need Murray to move on.
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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by wprager on Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:07 am

    spader wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    spader wrote:I like having Stone on the second line. I think he can play with anyone. He's one of those players that doesn't need a "good center to get him going" like some people. He elevates the game of others around him.

    When Stone came back from serving his suspension he was pretty bad.  Then, just as he was starting to come around Turris got injured and Stone was pretty awful.  

    When you focus on negatives, you'll always find them. I think he's been great. He has some consistency issues to resolve, but what young player doesn't?

    I'm not focusing on negatives, I'm just trying to temper the hyperbole a little. Stone is probably my favorite player on the team and the only one I'd consider if I ever got a named/numbered jersey (of course his number being my birth year has nothing to do with that Smile ). He was great in his first year and I still think he should have won the Calder. Leading the league in takeaways while *not* playing is a center is pretty rare, and to do it as a rookie is phenomenal. This year he started out a bit slow, then he really cooled off in December/January but has come on strong of late. He's 4th in the league in scoring among right-wingers, which is elite-level, in my books. If Canada wasn't exceptionally strong and center (and most centers can play wing) he'd be a lock for Team Canada (the other RW ahead of him are two Americans and a Russian). And on top of all that, offense isn't really the best part of his game. He *will* win the Selke eventually, and will probably do that many times over. If he wasn't playing on a really bad team he'd win it this year.


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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by spader on Sun Mar 20, 2016 2:32 pm

    wprager wrote:
    spader wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    spader wrote:I like having Stone on the second line. I think he can play with anyone. He's one of those players that doesn't need a "good center to get him going" like some people. He elevates the game of others around him.

    When Stone came back from serving his suspension he was pretty bad.  Then, just as he was starting to come around Turris got injured and Stone was pretty awful.  

    When you focus on negatives, you'll always find them. I think he's been great. He has some consistency issues to resolve, but what young player doesn't?

    I'm not focusing on negatives, I'm just trying to temper the hyperbole a little.  Stone is probably my favorite player on the team and the only one I'd  consider if I ever got a named/numbered jersey (of course his number being my birth year has nothing to do with that Smile ).  He was great in his first year and I still think he should have won the Calder.  Leading the league in takeaways while *not* playing is a center is pretty rare, and to do it as a rookie is phenomenal.  This year he started out a bit slow, then he really cooled off in December/January but has come on strong of late.  He's 4th in the league in scoring among right-wingers, which is elite-level, in my books.  If Canada wasn't exceptionally strong and center (and most centers can play wing) he'd be a lock for Team Canada (the other RW ahead of him are two Americans and a Russian).  And on top of all that, offense isn't really the best part of his game.  He *will* win the Selke eventually, and will probably do that many times over.  If he wasn't playing on a really bad team he'd win it this year.

    You say that you want to temper the hyperbole, then call him an elite-level, perennial Selke winner. Ok. scratch
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    Re: GAME DAY #72: Senators @ Sabres - 7:00 pm - Friday, March 18 2016

    Post by wprager on Sun Mar 20, 2016 6:01 pm

    It's not hyperbole to say he has elite level skill at taking the puck away. He was tied for the league lead in his rookie year, which was unusual for a winger, let alone a rookie. This year he is all alone in the lead (Skinner is 56 back). He has a legit chance at breaking the all-time record held by Datsyuk. There is no arguing here -- he is the best by a wide margin in the best league, and has a chance to be the best *ever*. Fine, it's a bit of a wonky stat, I realize that, but watching him play he just appears to have a sixth sense.

    He is fourth in the league in points by right wingers (and would likely be 2nd if the Sens had a decent PP -- Stone is 13th in PP points).

    So he has elite level skill at turning the puck over and is top-five at his position on the offensive side of the ledger. That's Selke in a nutshell. He's not going to win this year because the team is awful defensively and he, himself, is -1 (will probably change over the last 9 games but not enough). But it's a pretty safe bet that Stone will be up there sooner or later.


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