GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

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    Hobiesens
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by Hobiesens on Fri Oct 21, 2016 9:14 am

    wprager wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:I worked in the entertainment industry for some years doing booking and you would never book a band in a venue you knew was going to be sold out in advance. If it did, you tried your best to relocate to a bigger venue. If there are increased sales to be made, you make them. Just simple math.

    Sure, one-time event. What if you had to book the same act for 41 nights over 7 months?
    Same point. The building doesn't change neither does how you utilize it. I could see the difference in if they had to have a bigger or smaller building but if they can reconfigure the seats to have more at a latter date than you are wasting. The costs to maintain and service the building will be the same. Just less chance of revenue. So what if you don't sell out on most night. As long as it's more seats sold than you would sell on a smaller arena.

    What changes is that it becomes routine, and not an *event*. If you can pick up a pair of tickets any time you want (without paying a premium to the scalpers) then you start taking it for granted instead of planning for it in advance. It does make a difference.

    I was at the Preds game last Friday in Nashville and that was an event. When I go to a Sens game I look forward to it and I normally leave happy with the fact that it was nice to attend. When I left the Preds game I couldn't wait to go back, unfortunately I don't live there. The Preds put on a great show, the fans go crazy and the atmosphere is the best that I've ever seen compared to Montreal, Ottawa, Calgary, Toronto, Detroit and Buffalo. Two of the guys I was with have season tickets and both were in awe of how much fun going to the game was. It's a great fan experience and I cannot say the same about the Sens games. Another big part of it is that the Preds arena is downtown, right on the strip so people have some dinner and a few drinks and walk down to the game. This is so much better than hauling out to Kanata for a Friday night game.
    Another guy who I was with has been to 7 Preds games and said they are all the same, doesn't matter if it's a Wednesday night in January, the fans are very knowledgeable and hooked on hockey.
    The Sens should send some of their staff to different arenas to see how to really put on a good show.

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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by DefenceWinsChampionships on Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:43 am

    Hobiesens wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:I worked in the entertainment industry for some years doing booking and you would never book a band in a venue you knew was going to be sold out in advance. If it did, you tried your best to relocate to a bigger venue. If there are increased sales to be made, you make them. Just simple math.

    Sure, one-time event. What if you had to book the same act for 41 nights over 7 months?
    Same point. The building doesn't change neither does how you utilize it. I could see the difference in if they had to have a bigger or smaller building but if they can reconfigure the seats to have more at a latter date than you are wasting. The costs to maintain and service the building will be the same. Just less chance of revenue. So what if you don't sell out on most night. As long as it's more seats sold than you would sell on a smaller arena.

    What changes is that it becomes routine, and not an *event*. If you can pick up a pair of tickets any time you want (without paying a premium to the scalpers) then you start taking it for granted instead of planning for it in advance. It does make a difference.

    I was at the Preds game last Friday in Nashville and that was an event. When I go to a Sens game I look forward to it and I normally leave happy with the fact that it was nice to attend. When I left the Preds game I couldn't wait to go back, unfortunately I don't live there. The Preds put on a great show, the fans go crazy and the atmosphere is the best that I've ever seen compared to Montreal, Ottawa, Calgary, Toronto, Detroit and Buffalo. Two of the guys I was with have season tickets and both were in awe of how much fun going to the game was. It's a great fan experience and I cannot say the same about the Sens games. Another big part of it is that the Preds arena is downtown, right on the strip so people have some dinner and a few drinks and walk down to the game. This is so much better than hauling out to Kanata for a Friday night game.
    Another guy who I was with has been to 7 Preds games and said they are all the same, doesn't matter if it's a Wednesday night in January, the fans are very knowledgeable and hooked on hockey.
    The Sens should send some of their staff to different arenas to see how to really put on a good show.

    I mentioned this a few years back when the discussion of LeBreton was just beginning. Fact is the in-game experience in Ottawa sucks. The games aren't fun. There is nothing to do between periods and getting to the game and leaving is a nightmare. I am better off staying at home where beer isn't $10, on my comfortable couch, and I don't need to travel.

    Right now the Sens games attracts fans - not the casual fan who will walk by the arena with their friends and say "hey, let's go to a game tonight". The Blue Jays were very much the same back in the day. They would get their 10-15K fans. If you were in the mood you could walk up to the stadium and buy tickets. There is no chance of the casual fan doing this in Kanata. You have to drive out there, pay for parking, and then take a chance on buying a ticket. I am sure Melnyk understands this and will make LeBretron a landmark. We are also having this discussion after the Arizona game. People in Arizona don't even like Arizona. As a fan I would much rather see Tampa Bay, Boston, Detroit, etc than Arizona. I wouldn't waste the gas money to go to the game.

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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by LeCaptain on Fri Oct 21, 2016 12:15 pm

    TSN 1200 asked this on facebook and I would say 90% of the answers (and there were lots of them) say it's become too expensive, between the parking, food etc.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by MarkStone on Fri Oct 21, 2016 12:29 pm

    I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by DefenceWinsChampionships on Fri Oct 21, 2016 12:59 pm

    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by MarkStone on Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:08 pm

    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    When has the product been "bad" outside of a couple of seasons?

    Maybe people are BANDWAGONERS.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by Flo The Action on Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:25 pm

    MarkStone wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    When has the product been "bad" outside of a couple of seasons?

    Maybe people are BANDWAGONERS.
    Hate to break it to you buddy but in half the markets people are bandwagoners. Without them it's hard to keep he dollars coming in. You can be all elitist about being a true fan but you need it all to keep a team surviving.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by PTFlea on Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:27 pm

    We need to take the next step, those are the bandwagoners who will come around. It's been a while since the sens have been elite and the bandwagon ers are waiting I bet.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by MarkStone on Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:33 pm

    Flo The Action wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    When has the product been "bad" outside of a couple of seasons?

    Maybe people are BANDWAGONERS.
    Hate to break it to you buddy but in half the markets people are bandwagoners. Without them it's hard to keep he dollars coming in. You can be all elitist about being a true fan but you need it all to keep a team surviving.

    Canadian markets should not have bandwagon fans.

    We are not Florida.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by Flo The Action on Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:44 pm

    MarkStone wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    When has the product been "bad" outside of a couple of seasons?

    Maybe people are BANDWAGONERS.
    Hate to break it to you buddy but in half the markets people are bandwagoners. Without them it's hard to keep he dollars coming in. You can be all elitist about being a true fan but you need it all to keep a team surviving.

    Canadian markets should not have bandwagon fans.

    We are not Florida.

    Laughing3

    dude! take a visit to montreal.
    most of the arena is filled with bandwagoners. people that know a dozen of players on their own team and probably haven't got a clue of any off season changes that happen to the team. successful markets and their management understand how to market to bandwagoners. how to create excitement when there is none. how to rise sales to every day people. I know so many season ticket holders in montreal who simply focus on re-sale to bandwagoners. probably a good portion of lower bowl seats are actually owned by scalpers.

    don' for a second mistake large fanbase for real fanbase. they are just that much more successful at marketing a product. you should look at the habs of the late 90's terrible product and they had problems filling the rink. management changed all that with really good team marketing.


    i think that ottawa does a lot more marketing towards fans than to bandwagoners.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by wprager on Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:49 pm

    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    Thank you!

    While it's true that housing prices are high in Ottawa and housing, in general, has become overpriced relative to 40 years ago, housing is still a necessity whereas hockey tickets never have been and never will be. So saying people aren't too smart or are cheap because they would rather spend on a 365/24x7 necessity versus watching a bunch of millionnaires chase a little rubber disk on ice is, well, not very smart.

    Also, I can enjoy a hockey game almost as well for free. I doubt I could convince my kids that they could just watch someone else's family on tv with 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms while the six of us shared one main bathroom and no-one had their own bedroom.

    Oh, man, Ev, that was just monumentally ridiculous.


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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by Flo The Action on Fri Oct 21, 2016 2:53 pm

    wprager wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    Thank you!

    While it's true that housing prices are high in Ottawa and housing, in general, has become overpriced relative to 40 years ago, housing is still a necessity whereas hockey tickets never have been and never will be. So saying people aren't too smart or are cheap because they would rather spend on a 365/24x7 necessity versus watching a bunch of millionnaires chase a little rubber disk on ice is, well, not very smart.

    Also, I can enjoy a hockey game almost as well for free. I doubt I could convince my kids that they could just watch someone else's family on tv with 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms while the six of us shared one main bathroom and no-one had their own bedroom.

    Oh, man, Ev, that was just monumentally ridiculous.
    ev's on a tear today.

    we'll hear a different story from him once his wife pops a few out of the oven.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by MarkStone on Fri Oct 21, 2016 3:06 pm

    wprager wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    Thank you!

    While it's true that housing prices are high in Ottawa and housing, in general, has become overpriced relative to 40 years ago, housing is still a necessity whereas hockey tickets never have been and never will be. So saying people aren't too smart or are cheap because they would rather spend on a 365/24x7 necessity versus watching a bunch of millionnaires chase a little rubber disk on ice is, well, not very smart.

    Also, I can enjoy a hockey game almost as well for free. I doubt I could convince my kids that they could just watch someone else's family on tv with 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms while the six of us shared one main bathroom and no-one had their own bedroom.

    Oh, man, Ev, that was just monumentally ridiculous.

    Overpriced housing and spending beyond your means on a house (which I doubt you are, you've probably been in your house for a while) is not a necessity. People buy more house than they need, and they become house poor.

    I wasn't targeting anyone on here, but that's absolutely true for a TONNE of people. They become so house poor they can't spend money on entertainment.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by MarkStone on Fri Oct 21, 2016 3:09 pm

    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    Thank you!

    While it's true that housing prices are high in Ottawa and housing, in general, has become overpriced relative to 40 years ago, housing is still a necessity whereas hockey tickets never have been and never will be. So saying people aren't too smart or are cheap because they would rather spend on a 365/24x7 necessity versus watching a bunch of millionnaires chase a little rubber disk on ice is, well, not very smart.

    Also, I can enjoy a hockey game almost as well for free. I doubt I could convince my kids that they could just watch someone else's family on tv with 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms while the six of us shared one main bathroom and no-one had their own bedroom.

    Oh, man, Ev, that was just monumentally ridiculous.
    ev's on a tear today.

    we'll hear a different story from him once his wife pops a few out of the oven.

    First off, no you won't because I will never purchase a house that isn't within my means. I am not going to become house poor. That is what I was talking about, not normal house purchasing/renting.

    Also, I have no pity for people who complain about money when they have 4-5+ kids to look after. Unless you have twins or triplets, this is something you can easily control. I always chuckle when I see stories of low income people who have 5 kids to support.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by Flo The Action on Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:01 pm

    MarkStone wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    Thank you!

    While it's true that housing prices are high in Ottawa and housing, in general, has become overpriced relative to 40 years ago, housing is still a necessity whereas hockey tickets never have been and never will be. So saying people aren't too smart or are cheap because they would rather spend on a 365/24x7 necessity versus watching a bunch of millionnaires chase a little rubber disk on ice is, well, not very smart.

    Also, I can enjoy a hockey game almost as well for free. I doubt I could convince my kids that they could just watch someone else's family on tv with 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms while the six of us shared one main bathroom and no-one had their own bedroom.

    Oh, man, Ev, that was just monumentally ridiculous.
    ev's on a tear today.

    we'll hear a different story from him once his wife pops a few out of the oven.

    First off, no you won't because I will never purchase a house that isn't within my means. I am not going to become house poor. That is what I was talking about, not normal house purchasing/renting.

    Also, I have no pity for people who complain about money when they have 4-5+ kids to look after. Unless you have twins or triplets, this is something you can easily control. I always chuckle when I see stories of low income people who have 5 kids to support.
    people's lives change. people lose jobs, people's salaries don't follow inflation, things happen that demand costs. you could easily have only two kids and a house only for one of your kids to develop some medical problems to slowly feel overwhelmed. hey it could even be that you're investments or mutual funds aren't performing as they once were, or your mortgage rates have gone up. you can't simply think that you financial situation of one day that feels quite secure is the financial situation you will have in 10 years. regardless on the amount of kids you have. I agree though that having 5 kids might be stretching the financial security and that's a decision that isn't an easy one for some but i think putting an overarching response of financial irresponsibility on people is maybe a generalization that shouldn't be made.
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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by wprager on Fri Oct 21, 2016 5:59 pm

    MarkStone wrote:
    Flo The Action wrote:
    wprager wrote:
    DefenceWinsChampionships wrote:
    MarkStone wrote:I think a lot of people are too cheap or just not smart with their money. They buy overpriced homes that they can't afford, so they can't spend on anything else.

    Maybe they're being smart by not wasting their money on a bad product.

    Thank you!

    While it's true that housing prices are high in Ottawa and housing, in general, has become overpriced relative to 40 years ago, housing is still a necessity whereas hockey tickets never have been and never will be. So saying people aren't too smart or are cheap because they would rather spend on a 365/24x7 necessity versus watching a bunch of millionnaires chase a little rubber disk on ice is, well, not very smart.

    Also, I can enjoy a hockey game almost as well for free. I doubt I could convince my kids that they could just watch someone else's family on tv with 3 bathrooms and 4 bedrooms while the six of us shared one main bathroom and no-one had their own bedroom.

    Oh, man, Ev, that was just monumentally ridiculous.
    ev's on a tear today.

    we'll hear a different story from him once his wife pops a few out of the oven.

    First off, no you won't because I will never purchase a house that isn't within my means. I am not going to become house poor. That is what I was talking about, not normal house purchasing/renting.

    Also, I have no pity for people who complain about money when they have 4-5+ kids to look after. Unless you have twins or triplets, this is something you can easily control. I always chuckle when I see stories of low income people who have 5 kids to support.

    I have twins as the last two so I guess I am allowed to complain?

    It'll be my kids' income taxes that will be paying for your hip replacement and heart bypass surgeries. If it wasn't for families having >2 kids the population would decline and age significantly. There would be no internet boom and thus no high-paying tech jobs, and there would be fewer services that the government would be providing so fewer government jobs as well. Ottawa would become a ghost town.

    Yeah, I know I'm greatly oversimplifying things but what do you expect me to do when you greatly oversimplify your argument in the first place?

    Simple fact of the matter is that the *average* Canadian cannot afford *luxury* items like hockey tickets. They are *not* entertainment, they are luxury. Going to a movie is entertainment. Local theater. Picnic. Beach day. Netflix. All those can be done for the price of a *single* ticket.

    Weren't you talking about getting a fancy car not long ago?


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    Re: GDT - Game #4: Coyotes @ Sens, Oct 18, 2016, 7:30pm

    Post by MarkStone on Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:25 pm

    Hockey is entertainment, how is it luxury?

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