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Ottawa Senators (present and past) TIDBITS & QUICK HITS!

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wprager


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I still say those teams are more likely to relocate than Ottawa.

There B-Sens VP just announced he will resign at the end of this season.

Lagoon


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Ev wrote:I still think Stone will stick around, maybe not Duchene though. I would trade Dzingel even if they want/can afford to sign him. I'd like to get a D in return for him.

I'm just hoping we can finish better to win my over 71 bet haha.

I took the under 72.5

Way back then, I wish Bodog had a Who will draft Hughes or Kakko future?

Lagoon


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wprager wrote:Oh, man, I love the 20/20 retro-analysts. People in Pompei really should have taken their vacation up north. I mean, what were they thinking?!

Why don't we wait until the season is over and the lottery balls drawn.

Hindsight only counts when it wasn’t said before. I only know of three people that actually thought and tried to defend an opinion of using the 2018 draft pick.

And no, I won’t wait until the lottery balls have been drawn because doing that would basically be a literal example of hindsight in this case. Thanks though.

wprager

wprager
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It would be hindsight to prove your point, but not mine.

Show me the comments at the time of the draft or shortly before that said we should trade the #4 l overall.

I'll wait.


_________________
Hey, I don't have all the answers. In life, to be honest, I've failed as much as I have succeeded. But I love my wife. I love my life. And I wish you my kind of success.
- Dicky Fox

wprager

wprager
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So, Nick Paul won the fastest shatter *and* hardest shot? That's as good an explanation for their troubles as any.


_________________
Hey, I don't have all the answers. In life, to be honest, I've failed as much as I have succeeded. But I love my wife. I love my life. And I wish you my kind of success.
- Dicky Fox

Lagoon

Lagoon
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wprager wrote:It would be hindsight to prove your point, but not mine.

Show me the comments at the time of the draft or shortly before that said we should trade the #4 l overall.

I'll wait.

I’m good. I don’t even know what you are trying to say anyway. It is fairly common knowledge that All-Star and I said the Sens should (and would) give Colorado 2018 if they had any clue. The Sens proved us wrong and made the terrible decision to draft a decent winger in 2018 instead of one of all the franchise C’s, one franchise W and one franchise D available this year.

tim1_2

tim1_2
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Lagoon wrote:
wprager wrote:It would be hindsight to prove your point, but not mine.

Show me the comments at the time of the draft or shortly before that said we should trade the #4 l overall.

I'll wait.

I’m good. I don’t even know what you are trying to say anyway. It is fairly common knowledge that All-Star and I said the Sens should (and would) give Colorado 2018 if they had any clue. The Sens proved us wrong and made the terrible decision to draft a decent winger in 2018 instead of one of all the franchise C’s, one franchise W and one franchise D available this year.

I don't agree that we should have let Colorado have the 2018 pick. It wasn't a given that the Sens would be bottom of the league this season.

Lagoon

Lagoon
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tim1_2 wrote:
Lagoon wrote:
wprager wrote:It would be hindsight to prove your point, but not mine.

Show me the comments at the time of the draft or shortly before that said we should trade the #4 l overall.

I'll wait.

I’m good. I don’t even know what you are trying to say anyway. It is fairly common knowledge that All-Star and I said the Sens should (and would) give Colorado 2018 if they had any clue. The Sens proved us wrong and made the terrible decision to draft a decent winger in 2018 instead of one of all the franchise C’s, one franchise W and one franchise D available this year.

I don't agree that we should have let Colorado have the 2018 pick.  It wasn't a given that the Sens would be bottom of the league this season.

Did you expect a coaching change, new GM, new pro-talent scouts, trades, improved moral with a new owner, more front-office support, Ottawa becoming a free-agent hotbed, etc...or did you just think they’d be better because.

This also depends on what time frame you are referring to as to when you thought they’d be good because I also thought they’d be competitive had they kept Karlsson.

Flo The Action

Flo The Action
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tim1_2 wrote:
Lagoon wrote:
wprager wrote:It would be hindsight to prove your point, but not mine.

Show me the comments at the time of the draft or shortly before that said we should trade the #4 l overall.

I'll wait.

I’m good. I don’t even know what you are trying to say anyway. It is fairly common knowledge that All-Star and I said the Sens should (and would) give Colorado 2018 if they had any clue. The Sens proved us wrong and made the terrible decision to draft a decent winger in 2018 instead of one of all the franchise C’s, one franchise W and one franchise D available this year.

I don't agree that we should have let Colorado have the 2018 pick.  It wasn't a given that the Sens would be bottom of the league this season.

Really?

Take out Tkachuk, trade stone, trade Duchene and play this year with the spare parts we have a sprinkle of kids and dead contracts we’d be getting back and 100% you are dead last. You might not win the lottery but you’re in better shape to draft a player needed.

This was 100% ownership trying to sell seasons tickets and fans that we wouldn’t be bad.

I knew we’d suck, just look at the D. The writing was all over the wall.

Hockeyhero22000

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Duchene out the next 3 games as he goes home for the birth of his child

Lagoon

Lagoon
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Flo The Action wrote:
tim1_2 wrote:
Lagoon wrote:
wprager wrote:It would be hindsight to prove your point, but not mine.

Show me the comments at the time of the draft or shortly before that said we should trade the #4 l overall.

I'll wait.

I’m good. I don’t even know what you are trying to say anyway. It is fairly common knowledge that All-Star and I said the Sens should (and would) give Colorado 2018 if they had any clue. The Sens proved us wrong and made the terrible decision to draft a decent winger in 2018 instead of one of all the franchise C’s, one franchise W and one franchise D available this year.

I don't agree that we should have let Colorado have the 2018 pick.  It wasn't a given that the Sens would be bottom of the league this season.

Really?

Take out Tkachuk, trade stone, trade Duchene and play this year with the spare parts we have a sprinkle of kids and dead contracts we’d be getting back and 100% you are dead last. You might not win the lottery but you’re in better shape to draft a player needed.

This was 100% ownership trying to sell seasons tickets and fans that we wouldn’t be bad.

I knew we’d suck, just look at the D. The writing was  all over the wall.

There were some on here that actually stated our D would be better this year without the best defenceman (Karlsson) in the league.

tim1_2

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I did not expect the team to be "good", but I didn't think we'd be dead last. The D was the obvious area of concern as was talked about here at length all summer long, and especially after the Karlsson trade. And who knows...things could still turn around a little here if they do something about the defense....

Lagoon

Lagoon
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tim1_2 wrote:I did not expect the team to be "good", but I didn't think we'd be dead last.  The D was the obvious area of concern as was talked about here at length all summer long, and especially after the Karlsson trade.  And who knows...things could still turn around a little here if they do something about the defense....

Again, some on here said our D would be better without Karlsson.

And no, nothing will turn around in Ottawa anytime soon in my opinion. There are no saviours in our system, no picks to draft the ones available and no management that are competent. We will however be able to watch Colorado add Hughes, Kakko or Byram to an already high-octane system. Even if the Sens somehow aren’t in the basement to give Colorado one of those guys, give me anyone of the elite C’s left on the board: Turcotte, Cozens, Krebs, Dach, Newhook or Suzuki over the decision to draft Tkachuk. This isn’t hindsight, but it sure is a lack of foresight from Sens management.

tim1_2

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I won't argue that there's been a lack of foresight. But I like Tkachuk and I'm happy to have him.

It would've been a helluva ballsy PR move to give up the 4th overall pick in 2018 during season ticket sale time in the summer, basically committing yourself to be a basement team this season.

DefenceWinsChampionships


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You guys gotta relax. It's one pick. Tkachuk's skillset and pedigree are anomalies in the NHL. And even if Colorado gets the #1 pick, Jack Hughes IS NOT McDavid, Crosby, or Matthews. He will be a good player - no doubt. But he might end up being a RNH - an undersized, highly overrated center. I'd argue his skillset is similar to a Marner or Kane and I wouldn't build a franchise around either of those two players, despite how good they are. #1 picks aren't always slam dunks or players a franchise should build around (see RNH, Hischier, Ekblad , Yakupov, etc). Hughes is small and for a center that will be a problem if they get outmuscled on faceoffs and can't establish space in front of the net. If he is moved to the wing (which I think he will during his career) the whole argument of drafting a center goes out the window. Kakko is being compared to Laine, who is also not a center. Both of these guys will be good. But how much better are they than Tkahcuk and Duchene combined. That's how I look at this. Tkachuk will be a 60-70 point scorer. He's struggling now, yes, but he's going from a short NCAA season to a long NHL season on a crappy team. He will be significantly better next year and for many years to come.

I am not even concerned about the pick. Yes, it sucks not to have one. But the Sens will be bad next year, and probably the year after that. So maybe we get the #1 pick in the 2020 draft? That would be the Lafreniere/Byfield draft (both centers).

To me the real question is why Stone and Duchene aren't signed yet. This signals either last second deals (before the trade deadline) or trades. I'd lump Anderson, Dzingel and Ceci in the trade category as well. So Dorion better not sacrifice a good prospect for a late 1st rd pick. We saw what Glass did at the WJHC and what Vegas gave up for Pacioretty. Wouldn't Duchene look great in that system, who can afford to sign him long term? Maybe target a Provorov, Strome, Frost or Konecny in Philly for a Stone/Anderson combo (Philly may no longer be a good trading partner but using this as an example). Dzingel would be a dirt-cheap rental for a contending team. Maybe a team struggling to score goals up against the cap would be willing to give up a good prospect for a goal scoring, economic option. Minnesota, Dallas, Colorado, Nashville and Winnipeg all options there.

There will no doubt be changes in Ottawa. Melnyk and Boro addressed this in that awful video at the start of the year. For those doubting a plan, they said something along the lines of having essentially 20 or so rookies and/or young players on the team. Melnyk cannot afford to run this team and as such, we need to temper our expectations on what this team will look like going forward. Maybe in a few more years, if Lebreton sorts itself out or Melnyk sells, will we have a competitive team but the reality is Stone and Duchene (and Andy, Dzingel, Ceci, etc) are probably going to be traded. Maybe, just maybe, one of Stone or Duchene will be retained, but they would have been signed by now so my expectations are pretty low. But if you can ice a young, fast competitive team you're setting yourself up for long-term success.

Next year we'll see the integration of new players such as Formenton, Balcers, Batherson, Chlapik, Wolanin, and Brown on a permanent basis. Maybe someone like Glass is added via trade for Stone or Duchene. Add in a more mature White and Tkachuk, and a healthy Chabot. We will also have a new coach. Lots of changes on the horizon. Plus, two first rd picks next season. One of which will be our own and I don't foresee Karlsson signing in SJ and Thornton will probably retire. Both big blows to the Sharks. Need to stop focusing on what could have been and focus on what can be. It's the only way to make it as a Sens fan right now

tim1_2

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DefenceWinsChampionships wrote: I don't foresee Karlsson signing in SJ and Thornton will probably retire. Both big blows to the Sharks. Need to stop focusing on what could have been and focus on what can be. It's the only way to make it as a Sens fan right now

This is a good post, and yes, there's certainly long-term hope for the Sens with some important prospects already in place. Our long-term hope, though, will only amount to something if Melnyk leaves. We all assume this will happen sooner or later, but until it does, things will generally suck.

Flo The Action

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tim1_2 wrote:I won't argue that there's been a lack of foresight.  But I like Tkachuk and I'm happy to have him.  

It would've been a helluva ballsy PR move to give up the 4th overall pick in 2018 during season ticket sale time in the summer, basically committing yourself to be a basement team this season.


Way to run a franchise.... let’s Diddle up the future in order to maybe rescue a thousand season seats (which probably didn’t even happen)

Flo The Action

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tim1_2 wrote:
DefenceWinsChampionships wrote: I don't foresee Karlsson signing in SJ and Thornton will probably retire. Both big blows to the Sharks. Need to stop focusing on what could have been and focus on what can be. It's the only way to make it as a Sens fan right now

This is a good post, and yes, there's certainly long-term hope for the Sens with some important prospects already in place.  Our long-term hope, though, will only amount to something if Melnyk leaves.  We all assume this will happen sooner or later, but until it does, things will generally suck.  

And that IF is getting less and less plausible. That idiot has screwed the value of this deal and can probably run a bottom cap franchise on half packed arenas, TV revenues and expansion fees for a long time to come. If he can’t don’t discount him trying to look at sale via relocation to « maintain » the illusion of NHL worth for franchise which is something Bettman might come to accept.

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